TexasCHLforum.com

Doing some research. Have there been any documented cases of a cop rolling up on an active crime scene and actually shooting a non-cop CHL that was using his weapon defending himself or others.

Was in a meeting this afternoon discussing this and some were convinced it has happened and will continue to happen as more people carry their guns.

I asked that question in a thread a while back and no one was able to produce a link.

Thanks for the feedback.

As long as you don't point the firearm in their general direction and follow the LEO's orders then I don't see it happening.

Good points nightmare.

I've faced that argument. I have responded that I would rather be accidentally shot by a responding LEO than have myself and my family or friends murdered while waiting for a LEO.

nightmare69 wrote:As long as you don't point the firearm in their general direction and follow the LEO's orders then I don't see it happening.

There you go. Simple way to not get shot by the friendlies.

ShootDontTalk wrote:

nightmare69 wrote:As long as you don't point the firearm in their general direction and follow the LEO's orders then I don't see it happening.

There you go. Simple way to not get shot by the friendlies.

You must wear a CHL/LTC Badge or sash or vest.

nightmare69 wrote:As long as you don't point the firearm in their general direction and follow the LEO's orders then I don't see it happening.

The problem that most people may have (except those who are hard of hearing or have trained for such an occassion) is that if you're not directly looking at someone who addresses you in a stressful situation, a human's natural tendancy is to physically turn towards the person who is trying to get your attention, so that bringing the ears perpindicular to the sound source gives a more natural sound, increasing legibility and comprehension. And when someone with a gun in their hands turns towards a cop nowadays, they don't wait to see if your intent is hostile, they blast away.

I am firmly convinced (of course, it's just my humble opinion) that this is the root cause of many "friendly fire" incidents, or cops shooting civilians who have found themselves inserted into a shooting situation.

n5wd wrote: I am firmly convinced (of course, it's just my humble opinion) that this is the root cause of many "friendly fire" incidents, or cops shooting civilians who have found themselves inserted into a shooting situation.

If there are "many" friendly fire incidents, shouldn't there be some references somewhere?

ShootDontTalk wrote:

n5wd wrote: I am firmly convinced (of course, it's just my humble opinion) that this is the root cause of many "friendly fire" incidents, or cops shooting civilians who have found themselves inserted into a shooting situation.

If there are "many" friendly fire incidents, shouldn't there be some references somewhere?

Sure, they're filed right next to the report about how much crime is prevented with open carry.

ShootDontTalk wrote:

n5wd wrote: I am firmly convinced (of course, it's just my humble opinion) that this is the root cause of many "friendly fire" incidents, or cops shooting civilians who have found themselves inserted into a shooting situation.

If there are "many" friendly fire incidents, shouldn't there be some references somewhere?[/quote]

There have been quite a number of blue-on-blue shootings of undercover or off-duty officers, and more than one documented instance of a homeowner or shop-keeper with a gun in hand being shot by responding police officers, but I've never seen anyone put together a compilation of such events. Of course, with no one footing the bill, there may be no such compilation, so consider this as just a personal observation, if you will.

Police have certainly shot armed (or in some cases alleged to be armed) homeowners, no doubt about that. I don't know if any of them actually held a CHL.

http://www.star-telegram.com/news/local ... 50993.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/south-caroli ... en-suspect" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://abcnews.go.com/US/phoenix-family ... id=8756441" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I also remember some years back an armed business owner who was shot by police when he responded to a burglar alarm at his place of business just before the cops got there. I don't have a link to that one tho.

And I don't believe it is quite as simple as not pointing your firearm at the cops and following orders. That assumes officers will have excellent nearly complete understanding of the situation, and do nearly everything right in in every encounter...and likewise for the legally armed citizen. It does seem that cops do a remarkably good job of sorting things out on the fly, but it is still going to be a risky encounter. For both sides.

What are the statistical odds that you will ever need your weapon? Now compound that with an Officer showing up or already being there as you are in the process of using your weapon.... Chance are much better playing powerball.

Tell the people worried about this happening that I'll happily take my chances, as my luck isn't so good that I expect the police to already be there if I get into a serious bind!

flechero wrote:What are the statistical odds that you will ever need your weapon? Now compound that with an Officer showing up or already being there as you are in the process of using your weapon.... Chance are much better playing powerball.

Tell the people worried about this happening that I'll happily take my chances, as my luck isn't so good that I expect the police to already be there if I get into a serious bind!

You obviously believe the potential exist for you to need a weapon to defend yourself or you wouldn't have a CHL and wouldn't waste your time on this forum.
So, you win the mugging lottery and get the jump on a BG by pulling your weapon. BG puts hands in the air. What's next? Do you put your weapon away and hope the guy behaves while you call 911? Do you let him go before police get there so he can do it to someone else? How does this play out that you do not have your weapon aimed at the individual when police arrive? I assume you do not carry handcuffs or other restraint devices that would allow you to secure them until authorities arrive. So, what's the plan?