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Nursing Homes
Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:38 pm
by DevilDawg
I know this was brought up in the last session as a rider on one of the bills. But was there ever a determination? Are Nursing Homes considered Gun Free by default? Or do they have to post 30.06?
Mom is in one in New Braunfels and I haven't seen a 30.06, where as her last one did. The new one does however have a wing for Alzhimers and other mental patients we have to pass to get to her level of managed care wing.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 8:29 pm
by Pawpaw
PC §46.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE HOLDER.
(a) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder carries a handgun
on or about the license holder’s person under the authority of Subchapter H,
Chapter 411, Government Code, and intentionally displays the handgun in plain
view of another person in a public place.
(b) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder intentionally,
knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter
H, Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of whether the handgun is
concealed, on or about the license holder’s person:
(1) on the premises of a business that has a permit or license issued under
Chapter 25, 28, 32, 69, or 74, Alcoholic Beverage Code, if the business
derives 51 percent or more of its income from the sale or service of alcoholic
beverages for on-premises consumption, as determined by the Texas Alcoholic
Beverage Commission under Section 104.06, Alcoholic Beverage Code;
(2) on the premises where a high school, collegiate, or professional sporting
event or interscholastic event is taking place, unless the license holder is a
participant in the event and a handgun is used in the event;
(3) on the premises of a correctional facility;
(4) on the premises of a hospital licensed under Chapter 241, Health
and Safety Code, or on the premises of a nursing home licensed under
Chapter 242, Health and Safety Code, unless the license holder has written
authorization of the hospital or nursing home administration, as appropriate;
(5) in an amusement park; or
(6) on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other established place of
religious worship.
(c) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder intentionally,
knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority of Subchapter
H, Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of whether the handgun is
concealed, at any meeting of a governmental entity.
And then keep going down to paragraph (i):
(i) Subsections (b)(4), (b)(5), (b)(6), and (c) do not apply if the actor was not
given effective notice under Section 30.06.
And you see that the blue text does not apply unless the facility is posted or you were given effective notice.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 10:05 pm
by DevilDawg
Thanks PawPaw. I figured someone, or several would know the details.
I will however check the front entry at the main entrance just to make sure if they have it posted or not. Her building is around the back and we don't use the main entrance at all. They have a complex of about seven buildings in the campus. It isn't posted at her building, but I would prefer not to have any problems.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 7:52 am
by Dan20703
I have to post on this thread only for the comedy of it. My mother in law is in a nursing home and recently they put up a sign at the entrance. I started laughing as I walked up to the door and my wife couldn't understand why. They posted a 51% sign thinking that would be notice enough. No wonder all the residents seem so happy!
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:18 am
by Greybeard
Dan - That IS funny. And I suspect quite confusing to some.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:30 am
by Rex B
My MIL is in an assisted-living facility. They have a non-compliant 30.06 notice at the front door. Letters are about 3/8". Ignored.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:37 am
by C-dub
A couple of thoughts for the OP. You can be given oral notification that firearms are not allowed and if the building you want to go to is a separate building I think it would also have to be posted. So, if the main building is posted, but the building your mom is in is not, then you only have to avoid the main building while carrying. Also, be mindful of any papers you have been given or signed in case there is anything on them that has the 3006 language. I have not seen anything like this yet myself, but it could eventually start making it's way into various businesses as a form of notification.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:41 am
by Keith B
Dan20703 wrote:I have to post on this thread only for the comedy of it. My mother in law is in a nursing home and recently they put up a sign at the entrance. I started laughing as I walked up to the door and my wife couldn't understand why. They posted a 51% sign thinking that would be notice enough. No wonder all the residents seem so happy!
Actually, hospitals and nursing homes are actually required to post a '51% like' sign per Government Code 411.204
http://codes.lp.findlaw.com/txstatutes/ ... /H/411.204" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
The same wording is supposed to be there, but no 51 in the middle. Many people misread it and end up posting with the 51 in it.
Here is a post from our resident expert srothstein on the sign issue at hospitals and nursing homes
http://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php? ... 8&p=391531" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 9:03 am
by oohrah
^^ Keith, so as I read your post, this is a TABC requirement for all hospitals and nursing homes, and does not apply to CHL holders? And yet, I have not seen this sign on any hospitals or care centers I have visited recently.
I thought the only valid posting for a CHL at a hospital (not a bar) was the 30.06. Now I'm confused.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 10:07 am
by ShootDontTalk
I served as a Hospice Chaplain for three years so I was in and out of a lot of Nursing Homes and Assisted Care facilities. Sometimes 7 or 8 different ones each week. I never saw anything remotely resembling a 51% sign anywhere. Certainly not on an entrance or at a Nurse's station bulletin board. I would have remembered something so incongruous.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 3:36 pm
by thetexan
C-dub wrote:A couple of thoughts for the OP. You can be given oral notification that firearms are not allowed and if the building you want to go to is a separate building I think it would also have to be posted. So, if the main building is posted, but the building your mom is in is not, then you only have to avoid the main building while carrying. Also, be mindful of any papers you have been given or signed in case there is anything on them that has the 3006 language. I have not seen anything like this yet myself, but it could eventually start making it's way into various businesses as a form of notification.
I think the key word in 30.06 is 'property'. I would think that as long as the property is contiguous that signage anywhere on the property meets the statute concerning notification. I don't think a difference in buildings on the same contiguous property makes a difference as far as the language of 30.06 is concerned.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:24 pm
by Keith B
oohrah wrote:^^ Keith, so as I read your post, this is a TABC requirement for all hospitals and nursing homes, and does not apply to CHL holders? And yet, I have not seen this sign on any hospitals or care centers I have visited recently.
I thought the only valid posting for a CHL at a hospital (not a bar) was the 30.06. Now I'm confused.
Actually, it does apply to a CHL holder. However, the TABC code is outdated, not enforced for postings, and the charge would have to be under 46.035 which has an exemption if not posted with 30.06, so while they are by code to post it, it really doesn't mean anything if they do.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 8:57 pm
by DevilDawg
thetexan wrote:C-dub wrote:A couple of thoughts for the OP. You can be given oral notification that firearms are not allowed and if the building you want to go to is a separate building I think it would also have to be posted. So, if the main building is posted, but the building your mom is in is not, then you only have to avoid the main building while carrying. Also, be mindful of any papers you have been given or signed in case there is anything on them that has the 3006 language. I have not seen anything like this yet myself, but it could eventually start making it's way into various businesses as a form of notification.
I think the key word in 30.06 is 'property'. I would think that as long as the property is contiguous that signage anywhere on the property meets the statute concerning notification. I don't think a difference in buildings on the same contiguous property makes a difference as far as the language of 30.06 is concerned.
I take the "property" to mean any continuos property owned/operated by the entity posting as well. My sister did the paperwork so not sure if they have a disclaimers written inside there or not.
It's not a big deal as I just leave the pistol in the truck while inside, and re-holster when leaving. It is secluded enough and I have a small safe to lock it in.
The real issue for me was not being able to remember if any of the new legislation was going to change it overall.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 12:00 am
by C-dub
thetexan wrote:C-dub wrote:A couple of thoughts for the OP. You can be given oral notification that firearms are not allowed and if the building you want to go to is a separate building I think it would also have to be posted. So, if the main building is posted, but the building your mom is in is not, then you only have to avoid the main building while carrying. Also, be mindful of any papers you have been given or signed in case there is anything on them that has the 3006 language. I have not seen anything like this yet myself, but it could eventually start making it's way into various businesses as a form of notification.
I think the key word in 30.06 is 'property'. I would think that as long as the property is contiguous that signage anywhere on the property meets the statute concerning notification. I don't think a difference in buildings on the same contiguous property makes a difference as far as the language of 30.06 is concerned.
It may. I'm not sure.
Re: Nursing Homes
Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 7:05 am
by Keith B
C-dub wrote:thetexan wrote:C-dub wrote:A couple of thoughts for the OP. You can be given oral notification that firearms are not allowed and if the building you want to go to is a separate building I think it would also have to be posted. So, if the main building is posted, but the building your mom is in is not, then you only have to avoid the main building while carrying. Also, be mindful of any papers you have been given or signed in case there is anything on them that has the 3006 language. I have not seen anything like this yet myself, but it could eventually start making it's way into various businesses as a form of notification.
I think the key word in 30.06 is 'property'. I would think that as long as the property is contiguous that signage anywhere on the property meets the statute concerning notification. I don't think a difference in buildings on the same contiguous property makes a difference as far as the language of 30.06 is concerned.
It may. I'm not sure.
It does. There is no specifics in 30.06 for where to place the sign other than 'displayed in a conspicuous manner clearly visible to the public'. So, if it is on say a main building, then it would apply to all other buildings and the property.