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Legally you are responsible for every bullet that comes out of your muzzel.


I was just grabbing a quick bite to eat in a restaurant and something occured to me as it was around dinner hour and there were a lot of people around me.
If someone had to use a gun in there to shoot some wacko with a gun, who would be responsible for any permenant or otherwise hearing damage that a dozen or so people in that enclosed building me have?

The guy who actually fired the shot?
The guy who caused the shot to be fired?
What if both guys were engaged in shooting?


Depending on the answer, it is something to think about next when you are deciding whether you want to load a hot .357 magnum or .44 magnum or .10mm for "more stopping power." You might be okay with living with a ringing in your ears, but others might not be

Doug.38PR wrote:Legally you are responsible for every bullet that comes out of your muzzel.


I was just grabbing a quick bite to eat in a restaurant and something occured to me as it was around dinner hour and there were a lot of people around me.
If someone had to use a gun in there to shoot some wacko with a gun, who would be responsible for any permenant or otherwise hearing damage that a dozen or so people in that enclosed building me have?

The guy who actually fired the shot?
The guy who caused the shot to be fired?
What if both guys were engaged in shooting?


Depending on the answer, it is something to think about next when you are deciding whether you want to load a hot .357 magnum or .44 magnum or .10mm for "more stopping power." You might be okay with living with a ringing in your ears, but others might not be

Responsible in what sense?

Making a persons ears ring would be the least of my worries in such a situation.

As someone who lives with ringing and losses, due to the Navy's policy of using cotton for hearing protection in the 60s, I can testify that it's not pleasant.

A one time exposure to gunfire is not likely to do permanent damage, repetitive exposure causes more permanent damage than a single exposure, which is the reason so many kids damage their hearing over time.

That's not to say that someone might not decide to sue over it, but they better have had a recent exam be able to show permanent loss in order to succeed.

OTOH, I was a scheduled "expert witness" on a case a lot of years ago where a woman claimed that the volume of sound that came over her telephone caused permanent damage to her hearing. She claimed that she picked up the phone while one of her son's friends was playing loud rock music over the phone to him and that it damaged her hearing.

Although I would have been able to show that the network, by its nature, would not carry the volume and frequencies that she claimed caused the damage, the company paid her off anyway - deep pockets.

In general, you are responsible for all the consequences of your actions. "The other guy made me do it" is rarely an effective defense. However, I have never heard of such a suit being filed. I never even thought about it.

I have occasionally had someone fire a shot near me under a metal canopy while I had my ears off. The ringing goes away after an hour or so.

- Jim

That's not too high on my list of things to worry about, but it is worth considering.

I can still remember the concert that caused hearing damage to me way back in 1982. For the final song of the night, some friends and I wound up right in front of one of the stacks of speakers. I can remember not being able to hear words or music while the performer was singing...just a high-pitched squealing noise. That lasted a few seconds until I was able to shove my way out of there. But the ringing in my ears lasted for days.

I'm sure the decibel level was well over the legally allowed amount, but I didn't worry about it too much. And it never entered my mind to try and pursue a lawsuit over it.

At my job, presses are continuously running and putting out over 85dB. There are signs all over the place saying "You must wear hearing protection in this area", but I walk by the presses at least twice a day without it.

I've heard the noise from wooden pallets being thrown on the floor as loud as gun shots in my years here. After jumping ten feet in the air and coming down cussing and snarling, I just walk on (usually to the rest room).

I would think that a suit for hearing loss would be VERY hard to prove unless the person just had a hearing test. It would also be a nasty thing to do, especially if you just potentially saved their bacon by dispatching or scaring off a BG.

In a real engagment, most people who are witnessing the action or participating may not even hear the guns going off due to the mental and physical stress. If you do hear it, you will know the guns have fired, but the sound will have little impact like it does when you are relaxed.

If such was indeed a "lawful shoot", I'd like to think our new self defense insurance policy would cover the civil defense, if any ...

Heck, I've forgotten to have my muffs up several times in our little indoor firing room and I can still ... er, ah ... read lips quite well. Much of my hearing loss though likely came from what someone has already mentioned - too close to the speakers at concerts decades ago. And never did figure out how Alice Cooper did that ...

I wouldn't worry too much about it, though you can never be sure what crazy folks are going to sue you over...

Though that's not to say there aren't options, but I just can't find a comfortable enough IWB to carry it :

Sounds as if this would be something for a jury to decide in civil court.

I would be more concerned over a "mental anguish" suit or something along those lines.

txinvestigator wrote:

Doug.38PR wrote:Legally you are responsible for every bullet that comes out of your muzzel.


I was just grabbing a quick bite to eat in a restaurant and something occured to me as it was around dinner hour and there were a lot of people around me.
If someone had to use a gun in there to shoot some wacko with a gun, who would be responsible for any permenant or otherwise hearing damage that a dozen or so people in that enclosed building me have?

The guy who actually fired the shot?
The guy who caused the shot to be fired?
What if both guys were engaged in shooting?


Depending on the answer, it is something to think about next when you are deciding whether you want to load a hot .357 magnum or .44 magnum or .10mm for "more stopping power." You might be okay with living with a ringing in your ears, but others might not be

Responsible in what sense?

Making a persons ears ring would be the least of my worries in such a situation.

Big time ditto!

Article in today's Dallas Morning News about hearing damage suffered by musicians, and not just loud rockers.

http://www.dallasnews.com/video/dallasn ... vid=153885

Makes me wonder if all those years of trumpet and Sousaphone before the Navy contributed to wht the Navy did with 5 inch guns.

txinvestigator wrote:

Doug.38PR wrote:Legally you are responsible for every bullet that comes out of your muzzel.


I was just grabbing a quick bite to eat in a restaurant and something occured to me as it was around dinner hour and there were a lot of people around me.
If someone had to use a gun in there to shoot some wacko with a gun, who would be responsible for any permenant or otherwise hearing damage that a dozen or so people in that enclosed building me have?

The guy who actually fired the shot?
The guy who caused the shot to be fired?
What if both guys were engaged in shooting?


Depending on the answer, it is something to think about next when you are deciding whether you want to load a hot .357 magnum or .44 magnum or .10mm for "more stopping power." You might be okay with living with a ringing in your ears, but others might not be

Responsible in what sense?

Making a persons ears ring would be the least of my worries in such a situation.

Granted, but after the fact, once everybody in, let's say, Chili's realizes he is okay and not shot by any stray bullet. Piece of Garbage Wildman has been put in the can by Mr. 38 and life goes on. The guy at the table that was next to you during said incident then decide to sue somebody for hearing damage. Who do they bring a case against?

Doug.38PR wrote:Granted, but after the fact, once everybody in, let's say, Chili's realizes he is okay and not shot by any stray bullet.... The guy at the table that was next to you during said incident then decide to sue somebody for hearing damage. Who do they bring a case against?

You, Chili's, and possibly the criminal's estate.

Always sue the property owner. They have good insurance and you win half the time.

I doubt any robber has an estate worth going after. That's why they're robbers.

- Jim