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Wow & double wow! Thanks for posting Andy! This should be require reading for every forum member, and I suggest this made into a 'sticky' , as the information is so relevant to what we discuss here daily.

joe817 wrote:Wow & double wow! Thanks for posting Andy! This should be require reading for every forum member, and I suggest this made into a 'sticky' , as the information is so relevant to what we discuss here daily.

Absolutely.

Great article.

It's a good article. Not to knock the article at all, but anyone who has spent a week working in a big ER could tell you this. People have trouble believing it, but when you see a patient die and their skull and face are actually misshapen from a beating administered with fists.........and you see this more than once.....you have no trouble believing that it can happen to you. It is nothing to fool around with. There are human predators out there who are either crazy enough, or sadistic enough, that they enjoy doing that to someone. THAT is why I would consider any assault with even bare hands or feet against me as an unlawful use of deadly force, and will respond accordingly. I'm not a young man anymore, and my rough and tumble youth is well behind me.

I thought about posting this comment in the other thread about use of force but not deadly force but I think it goes better here.

My LTC instructor pointed out that even if a person attacking you does not have a gun you do not know their level of proficiency in using their hands.

I knew a guy in the Army with an odd, pushed in looking face.

One day, while cleaning our rifles, he talked about getting hit in the face with four separate punches (he was on the ground on his back) each punch broke facial bones and ultimately pushed in his entire face.

He barely survived this beating and even with plastic surgery looks very odd...poor guy, but he was lucky to have survived such savagery.

Yeah, fists, feet, elbows, head butts all can kill you or maim you.

AndyC wrote:

The Annoyed Man wrote:THAT is why I would consider any assault with even bare hands or feet against me as an unlawful use of deadly force, and will respond accordingly.

That's exactly why I posted this article. For legal purposes following a shooting, you'd be able to articulate and cite your awareness/knowledge of blunt force as a potentially lethal threat before the incident even occurred

But you should only tell it to your lawyer. Don't talk to the police!!!

Let me add this, Cardiac arrest secondary to blunt force trauma has a less than 1% chance at survival!

When the heart beats it's measured by the electrical activity of the heart, what is called the PQRS complex, the P wave signals the heart to beat, the Q wave is the atrium contracting, the R wave is the ventricles contracting, the S is the heart momentarily at rest, then the T wave which is the heart repolarizing for the next beat, if you take a blow to the chest between the S and T wave this will disrupt the hearts normal repolarization, essentially stopping the heart, it is a rare occurrence but it has happened!

crazy2medic wrote:Let me add this, Cardiac arrest secondary to blunt force trauma has a less than 1% chance at survival!

When the heart beats it's measured by the electrical activity of the heart, what is called the PQRS complex, the P wave signals the heart to beat, the Q wave is the atrium contracting, the R wave is the ventricles contracting, the S is the heart momentarily at rest, then the T wave which is the heart repolarizing for the next beat, if you take a blow to the chest between the S and T wave this will disrupt the hearts normal repolarization, essentially stopping the heart, it is a rare occurrence but it has happened!

Remember the good old bad old days of the precordial thump?

Excellent article!

Thanks, Andy!

The Annoyed Man wrote:

crazy2medic wrote:Let me add this, Cardiac arrest secondary to blunt force trauma has a less than 1% chance at survival!

When the heart beats it's measured by the electrical activity of the heart, what is called the PQRS complex, the P wave signals the heart to beat, the Q wave is the atrium contracting, the R wave is the ventricles contracting, the S is the heart momentarily at rest, then the T wave which is the heart repolarizing for the next beat, if you take a blow to the chest between the S and T wave this will disrupt the hearts normal repolarization, essentially stopping the heart, it is a rare occurrence but it has happened!

Remember the good old bad old days of the precordial thump?

Yes, I laugh at some the shows from the 70s when I see that!

There have actually been a significant number of kids killed by baseballs hitting them in the chest, interrupting the heart beat, as crazy2medic suggests. Net net is that blunt force trauma has the potential to be EVERY BIT as deadly as a bullet or edged weapon. That's yet ANOTHER reason all of the crazy activist/media coverage vilifying the police (or anyone, for that matter) shooting an "unarmed" person is particularly troubling......