Carry in unposted hospital?

[HighVelocity]

I cannot remember if there was anything in the penal code about hospitals.
My wife is having minor surgery. It's outpatient but it's at the hospital. I'll probably be there for 4-6 hours.
The hospital is not posted with any signage whatsoever.

What does the law say?

[KBCraig]

Just like churches: off limits, BUT they must be properly posted per 30.06 to be truly off limits.

Kevin

[one eyed fatman]

Just like churches: off limits, BUT they must be properly posted per 30.06 to be truly off limits.

Kevin

Can't have it both ways. But I will quote you on this:

they must be properly posted per 30.06 to be truly off limits.

[dws1117]

I'll be intrested in this as well. We will be spending more time at the hospital as it gets closer to baby time.

From Packing.org:

Title 10 Chpt. 46 § 46.03

* A place of business that derives 51% or more of its income from the sale or service of alcoholic beverages for on premises consumption
* On premises of a correctional facility
* On the physical premises of a school, an educational institution, or a passenger transportation vehicle of a school or an educational institution, whether the school or educational institution is public or private,
* On the premises where a high school, collegiate or professional sporting event of interscholastic event is taking place, unless the license holder is a participant in the event and a handgun is used in the event
* On the premises of a polling place on the day of an election or while early voting is in progress.
* racetrack; secured area of an airport
* In any government court or offices utilized by the court, unless pursuant to written regulations or written authorization of the court.
* *on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other established place of religious worship.
* *On the premises of a Hospital licensed under the Health and Safety Code
* *On the premises of a nursing home licensed under the Health and Safety Code
* *Amusement parks. Amusement Parks means a permanent indoor or outdoor facility or park where amusement rides are available for use by the public that is located in a county with a population of more than one million, encompasses at least 75 acres in surface area, is enclosed with access only through controlled entries, is open for operation more than 120 days in each calendar year, and has security guards on the premises at all times. The term does not include any public or private driveway, street, sidewalk or walkway, parking lot, parking garage, or other parking area.
* Public or private premises conspicuously posted with this sign do
* Items above marked * Do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06.

Based on this it would seem that hospitals are off limits? What does "licensed under the Health and Safety Code" mean?

[KBCraig]

Just like churches: off limits, BUT they must be properly posted per 30.06 to be truly off limits.

Kevin

Can't have it both ways.

The law does have it both ways. PC 46.035(b)(4) defines "Unlawfully Carrying a Weapon by a License Holder" to include carrying on the premises of a hospital or nursing home.

And then --ta-da-- the law reverses that position.

But I will quote you on this:

they must be properly posted per 30.06 to be truly off limits.

PC 46.035(i) says that 46.035(b)(4) does not apply unless you are given effective notice under PC 30.06.

So, I wasn't trying to confuse the issue, but the law does say both things, and it's easy to reach the wrong conclusion if you stop reading too soon. The law says you're UCW if you carry in a hospital or nursing home, but then says that section does not apply unless you're given effective notice under 30.06.

For those wondering how this came to be, the legislature found it more expedient to add 46.035(i) than to delete 46.035(b)(4), along with the other paragraphs covered by (i).

Kevin

[Piney]

I'm a bit confused- as is the usual case when dealing the CHL laws *sigh* Im asking because I expect to spend several days hospital-sitting in the near future.

Other posts in the thread appear to imply that a CHL holder cannot carry in *any* hospital. The quote from the packing.org site isn't complete-- it leaves out some of the sections of the law.

http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/ftp/forms/ls-16.pdf

Section 46.035 appears to say that CHL carry is not permitted in a hospital ONLY if is it properly posted under the 30.06 laws.

The initial wording does say it is illegal (section b-4). However, section i states that it is not an offence is proper notice was not given.

Soooo-- which is it ? I can not carry in ANY hospital or just not in those with proper 30.06 postings ?

[HighVelocity]

Soooo-- which is it ? I can not carry in ANY hospital or just not in those with proper 30.06 postings ?

Hopefully Chas will be able pitch in on this.

[KBCraig]

Section 46.035 appears to say that CHL carry is not permitted in a hospital ONLY if is it properly posted under the 30.06 laws.

That's correct. CHL carry in a hospital or nursing home was prohibited until 46.035(i) was added (I forget what year it was added).

And now, as you've read, the hospital/nursing home prohibitions "do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice Section 30.06."

The previous prohibitions made "DNA" by 46.035(i) are: hospitals or nursing homes; amusement parks; churches or places of worship; and meetings of governmental entities.

You have to know the history of the CHL laws for this to make any sense, but once you know the sequence, it becomes a little clearer.

PC 46.035(i) Subsections (b)(4), (b)(5), (b)(6), and (c) do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06.

Kevin

[Charles L. Cotton]

Kevin is correct; if there is no 30.06 sign, you can carry in a hospital, nursing home or at a meeting of a governmental entity or agency.

TPC §30.06 was added in 1997 and I believe it was made applicable to hospitals during that same session. One of the reasons is that hospitals, nursing homes and locations where a governmental entity or agency is meeting are sometimes difficult to identity. Regardless of the motive, "no sign = no prohibition."

Chas.

[HighVelocity]

Thanks everyone for clearing this up. I was under the impression that no sign = no problem but wasn't certain.

[ElGato]

Don't forget that some Hospitals aren't what they seem, UTMB and Baylor are Schools and the VA Hospital is Federal and there are bound to be other's, these thing's aside if there's no 30.06 CARRY, I do it all the time.

Tomcat

[stevie_d_64]

Don't forget that some Hospitals aren't what they seem, UTMB and Baylor are Schools and the VA Hospital is Federal and there are bound to be other's, these thing's aside if there's no 30.06 CARRY, I do it all the time.

Tomcat

Ohhhh, good point!

Ben Taub (Houston) is another one...Teaching Hospital...

(Steve slapping his forehead on this one)

[anygunanywhere]

Again, the legislature really needs to correct the vague definitions that cloud CHL law and carry in Texas. "Travel" and "school" are huge ones. Just because a hospital is a 'teaching hospital" does not make it a school. Also, Ben Taub is a government building, owned by the Harris County Hospital District. Besides, having done my paramedic training at "The Tub" many moons ago, if there ever was a hospital where you need to pack, it is "The Tub!"


If I was to be shot, that hospital is where I would want to be treated. Ben Taub is where the Secret Service would take the President when he is in Houston.

[HighVelocity]

When I lived in HOuston we called it "Been Stabbed"

[stevie_d_64]

Again, the legislature really needs to correct the vague definitions that cloud CHL law and carry in Texas. "Travel" and "school" are huge ones. Just because a hospital is a 'teaching hospital" does not make it a school. Also, Ben Taub is a government building, owned by the Harris County Hospital District. Besides, having done my paramedic training at "The Tub" many moons ago, if there ever was a hospital where you need to pack, it is "The Tub!"


If I was to be shot, that hospital is where I would want to be treated. Ben Taub is where the Secret Service would take the President when he is in Houston.

You are correct...

I only drove the ambulance there a few times for the VFD I was associated with...

Needless to say I learned a lot, and agree that is where you wanna go if the need arises...

I carried there when "Wife Unit" had to have her gall bladder removed a couple years ago...I didn't think it was that big a deal...And son of a gun if nothing happened while I was armed...