Trump: Banning Suppressors?

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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#61

Post by Charles L. Cotton » Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:13 pm

anygunanywhere wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:50 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:22 pm
anygunanywhere wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:41 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:35 pm
anygunanywhere wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:30 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:24 pm
anygunanywhere wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:07 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:27 pm
anygunanywhere wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:14 pm
carlson1 wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:06 pm

Bump stocks not worth dying for, suppressors not worth dying for, low round magazines not worth dying for, ammo not worth dying for, carrying a firearm outside your house not worth dying for, etc.... where do we say NO?
At the rate our 2A rights are slowly being eroded, we are dying a death of 1000 cuts. It is time the other side gets cut. Multiple times. Our side is tired of losing. And don’t even say the word compromise.
You say that "our 2A rights are slowly being eroded, . . ." Please list the specific erosion(s) you mean. Generalizations are easy to state, but I'm interested in the specific laws/restrictions.

Chas.
Bump Stocks. That is an erosion. First the ATF ruled they were not machine guns. Now they are machine guns.

I would like to hear about all of the advances we have achieved at the federal level in the last two years.
So your "slow erosion" consists of one thing -- bump stocks.

Chas.
To the hundreds of thousands of patriots who own them, Charles, this is a big deal. It DOES speak volumes if you ask them. It is an erosion. Whether or not you hold this as a big deal is your opinion and it really doesn't matter if I wrote a book on erosion of 2A rights or gave you one example, the bump stock ban is an infringement.

I asked for advances we gained at the federal level in the last two years.

**CRICKETS**
You expressly stated "At the rate our 2A rights are slowly being eroded, we are dying a death of 1000 cuts. One event, bump stocks, is neither 1,000 cuts nor a slow "erosion." My point is the Chicken Little approach doesn't help advance Second Amendment rights, especially when you conspicuously ignore progress on that front.

As for your two-year question; 1) I didn't claim any claims as did you; and 2) of course you want to limit any claims of advancement of firearms rights to two years because you know there have been several since the 1968 Gun Control act or the 1934 NFA.

Chas.
My approach is not a Chicken Little approach. I'm not screaming that the sky is falling. so please stop mischaracterizing my comments. The bump stock ban is a Trump presidency ban. Give me Trump presidency advancements in our 2A freedoms. I never brought up the NFA or GCA. You did. I'm certain I could mischaracterize your claim of advancements since the GCA and NFA. THE ATF is still in full force. Everything banned and regulated by the NFA and GCA are still banned and regulated. The Feds have not let up one bit. Oh wait!! Obama lets us carry in National Parks!! Halleluia!! We get to carry on land that we, American Citizens Own!
You made a false statement and you are now trying to avoid the question. You claimed a slow erosion of Second Amendment rights, but you can only list one item -- bump stocks. You know quite well the only point I'm making is that there is no slow erosion of Second Amendment rights. Yes, there are restrictions that should not exist, but they have been in place for decades. Over those same decades, we have expanded gun rights at the federal level. Not as much as in Texas and other states, but progress has been made, contrary to your insinuation.

Of course you didn't bring up the GCA 68 or the NFA. You don't want to acknowledge the progress we've made since 1968. BTW, Obama didn't let us carry in national parks. That provision was shoved down his throat as part of the credit card bill have was forced to sign.

Chas.
Progress since 1968? What progress??
You're really are desperate to get away from your erosion claim, aren't you? Okay, I know I can't recall every bill that passed in the last 51 years, but here are some off the top of my head.

1. Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 protects travelers with firearms;
2. Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act prohibiting frivolous lawsuits to put manufacturers and dealers out of business;
3. Emergency Powers Act prohibiting New Orleans-style firearm confiscation during disasters;
4. Prohibition on ban of firearms in National Parks
5. Repeal of ban on buying long guns in states other than one's state of residence or contiguous states;
6. Prohibiting the destruction of military brass;

There are probably more, but that's what I can recall at this point.

Chas.
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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#62

Post by anygunanywhere » Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:53 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:13 pm

You're really are desperate to get away from your erosion claim, aren't you? Okay, I know I can't recall every bill that passed in the last 51 years, but here are some off the top of my head.

1. Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 protects travelers with firearms;
2. Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act prohibiting frivolous lawsuits to put manufacturers and dealers out of business;
3. Emergency Powers Act prohibiting New Orleans-style firearm confiscation during disasters;
4. Prohibition on ban of firearms in National Parks
5. Repeal of ban on buying long guns in states other than one's state of residence or contiguous states;
6. Prohibiting the destruction of military brass;

There are probably more, but that's what I can recall at this point.

Chas.
Charles, you are the one having a problem with my use of the term slow erosion. As I stated before the erosion even with my one example is huge for the patriots who owned bump stocks. You? Not so much. You threw bump stock owners under the bus so you could focus on more important issues. Things that really mattered, at least to the NRA board. Your continued claim that my term is insignificant just shows the gap that exists between the upper echelon, the elites and those of us common folk. The NRA's responsibility is to protect everyone's firearms rights, not just those that they think are worth their time and trouble.

Thank you for the list, sir. Wow. The NRA has accomplished all that since 1968. I have a few comments though. FOPA is a flop. We still can't drive through Maryland, New Jersey, New, York or many other Northeast states because they ignore FOPA. National Parks Ban? We can't carry in the buildings. I have bought long guns in Louisiana.

You might be impressed with that list but I am not. I'm holding that list in the same light as you do my slow erosion.

I'm done for this thread. I'm going to wait and see if suppressors are thrown under the bus too. Bump stocks were never officially named as being used in the Vegas shooting. Government coverup. Ban bump stocks to make the commies happy. Suppressors are used more in crimes every year than bump stocks ever were.
"America is like a healthy body and its resistance is threefold: Its patriotism, Its morality, and its spiritual life. If we can undermine these three areas, America will collapse from within." Joseph Stalin


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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#63

Post by MaduroBU » Fri Jun 07, 2019 11:14 pm

Jerry Miculek did a video on using a pillow as a silencer: It was exceptionally effective for 3-4 shots.

https://youtu.be/cnMeTlXsXC8

A metal device that makes the deafening report of a firearm safer while being handily outdone in pure sound suppression by an untraceable pillow can hardly be a good target for legislation.

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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#64

Post by Bitter Clinger » Sat Jun 08, 2019 12:20 pm

Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:48 pm
Bitter Clinger wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:51 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:28 pm
Bitter Clinger wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:23 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:27 pm
anygunanywhere wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:14 pm
carlson1 wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:06 pm
jason812 wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:39 pm
The Annoyed Man wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:52 pm
They can ban them all they want. It will seriously tick me off, but it won’t stop me from having one if I want one. I know where to buy solvent traps, and I know how to make a suppressor. My son is a very highly qualified machinist. Making our own parts off the books is not a problem....if we have to.
:iagree:
They are not hard to make. Even easier if you have the right tools and know how to use them. :coolgleamA:

Bump stocks were not a sword to die on, are suppressors?
Bump stocks not worth dying for, suppressors not worth dying for, low round magazines not worth dying for, ammo not worth dying for, carrying a firearm outside your house not worth dying for, etc.... where do we say NO?
At the rate our 2A rights are slowly being eroded, we are dying a death of 1000 cuts. It is time the other side gets cut. Multiple times. Our side is tired of losing. And don’t even say the word compromise.
You say that "our 2A rights are slowly being eroded, . . ." Please list the specific erosion(s) you mean. Generalizations are easy to state, but I'm interested in the specific laws/restrictions.

Chas.
Not only did I fill out the forms, pay the $200 tax and wait months to be able to bail my SBR out of the safe at my FFL, but now I need to submit a properly filled out form to the ATF and wait weeks for permission to take my SBR across state lines to attend a training clinic. What part of shall not be infringed am I enjoying right about now?
So your version of a "slow erosion" ended in 1934.

Chas.
FIFY. "So your version of a "slow erosion" began in 1934". :tiphat:
Nice try, but no cigar. Only you and Anygunanywhere are claiming there is an erosion of Second Amendment rights. When asked to list the events that are part of that erosion, each of you could list only one law. Yours dates back to 1934. Erosion is a process, not a single event. More pro-gun bills than anti-gun bills have been passed at the federal level. We've done much better at the state level in many states, but that's just the difference in the makeup of Congress. My point is simply that overstating a problem doesn't help solve it; it simply destroys your credibility.

Chas.
To the extent that we do not enjoy Constitutional Carry in all 50 states, there has clearly been an erosion of rights. This does not take way from the very real efforts made to re-gain, but to deny erosion is simply playing lawyerly semantics.
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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#65

Post by Paladin » Sat Jun 08, 2019 12:46 pm

MaduroBU wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 11:14 pm
Jerry Miculek did a video on using a pillow as a silencer: It was exceptionally effective for 3-4 shots.

https://youtu.be/cnMeTlXsXC8

A metal device that makes the deafening report of a firearm safer while being handily outdone in pure sound suppression by an untraceable pillow can hardly be a good target for legislation.
Jerry's videos are great!
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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#66

Post by Charles L. Cotton » Sat Jun 08, 2019 8:28 pm

anygunanywhere wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:53 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:13 pm

You're really are desperate to get away from your erosion claim, aren't you? Okay, I know I can't recall every bill that passed in the last 51 years, but here are some off the top of my head.

1. Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986 protects travelers with firearms;
2. Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act prohibiting frivolous lawsuits to put manufacturers and dealers out of business;
3. Emergency Powers Act prohibiting New Orleans-style firearm confiscation during disasters;
4. Prohibition on ban of firearms in National Parks
5. Repeal of ban on buying long guns in states other than one's state of residence or contiguous states;
6. Prohibiting the destruction of military brass;

There are probably more, but that's what I can recall at this point.

Chas.
Charles, you are the one having a problem with my use of the term slow erosion. As I stated before the erosion even with my one example is huge for the patriots who owned bump stocks.
"Erosion" is a continuing process, not a single event. Your false claim of "erosion" of gun rights implies that there is a continuing loss of those rights and that simply is not true. The overall trajectory of gun rights has been an upward trend since the unconstitutional GCA of 1968. That's the exact opposite of an "erosion" of Second Amendment rights. The only downturn during that 51 year period was the Clinton/Assault Weapons ban from 1994 to 2004, but we turned that around in spite of repeated attempts to reinstate it.

I initially asked you to list the events supporting your "erosion" claim because such false aligations are insulting to so many people who have worked hard to expand gun rights and block anti-gun bills and regulations. I'm not talking about me, I'm I'm talking about many people. Some of us have made that a lifelong quest, yet people like you mock our efforts and make false claims about our success. The job has been infinitenately harder at the federal level because of the makeup of the federal Congress, so our gains are fewer than here in Texas and many other states. But less progress does not mean no progress and your claim of an "erosion" of gun rights is both false and insulting. You have been a Forum member for fourteen years and have over 7,000 posts. It is exceedingly rare for you to ever make a positive statement about progress we've made on gun rights, whether at the federal or state level. Yet there is no shortage of your gloom-and-doom posts.
anygunanywhere wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:53 pm
You threw bump stock owners under the bus so you could focus on more important issues. Things that really mattered, at least to the NRA board.
Ignoring the facts is necessary in order for you to make this absurd claim. Bump stocks are important to the people who own them, but that number is tiny compared to the number of people that own AR platform rifles and pistol, AK platform rifles, H&K platform rifles/pistols, etc. That is what was at stake. You and your ilk either don't believe or choose to ignore the tidal wave of calls for another assault weapons ban after the Las Vegas slaughter. I cannot and will not give full details for obvious reasons, but the NRA quite literally saved those firearms from being banned. Yet you want to ignore that fact and essentially claim that bump stocks "were thrown under the buss." Apparently, you would have preferred that the NRA do nothing. The result would have been a new and a much farther-reaching assault weapons band and your bump stock poster-child would have also been banned. You are also ignoring the fact that the bump stock issue is far from over. Ironically, the ATF reclassification of bump stocks may actually bring an end to the BATFE's unlawful usurpation of regulatory authority.
anygunanywhere wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:53 pm
Your continued claim that my term is insignificant just shows the gap that exists between the upper echelon, the elites and those of us common folk. The NRA's responsibility is to protect everyone's firearms rights, not just those that they think are worth their time and trouble.
You clearly do not feel constrained by the truth. I've never stated that your use of the term "erosion" is "insignificant." My clear and unambiguous statement is that "erosion" is an ongoing process, not a single event. I've also never stated that the attempt at a bump stock ban is "insignificant." It is significant to the people who own them, just as the lawful possession and use of so-called assault weapons is significant to over 5 million Americans.

Your "upper echelon, the elites" and "common folks" comments are great examples of your self-righteous, arrogant know-it-all attitude. You don't know the first thing about me and people who do will tell you I'm the furthest thing from an "elitist." I won't bother responding to your latest lie about the NRA selecting which firearms are worth protecting. It's nothing more than your typical hyperbole.
anygunanywhere wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:53 pm
Thank you for the list, sir. Wow. The NRA has accomplished all that since 1968. I have a few comments though. FOPA is a flop. We still can't drive through Maryland, New Jersey, New, York or many other Northeast states because they ignore FOPA. National Parks Ban? We can't carry in the buildings. I have bought long guns in Louisiana.

You might be impressed with that list but I am not. I'm holding that list in the same light as you do my slow erosion.
I must express my gratitude for your comments about progress made on the federal front. Nothing I could type could better exemplify your utter disdain for progress and the fact that you live in denial. There is no "erosion" of gun rights; progress has been made and is ongoing. Progress on the federal front is not as rapid as either of us wish, but it exists and there is no "erosion" of gun rights.

FOPA is not a "flop." Tens of millions of American gun owners travel throughout the country with firearms that would have resulted in their arrest, conviction and imprisonment were it not for FOPA. You name three states that have not followed FOPA as they should have, but you ignore the others. (Do you care to expound on your nebulous claim about "many other Northeast states" by listing specific states?) Even your claims about Maryland, New Jersey and New York are inaccurate. While there have been unlawful arrests, those have been very few, primarily because of the lawsuits filed by or on behalf of the NRA that you so love to denigrate.
anygunanywhere wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 9:53 pm
I'm done for this thread. I'm going to wait and see if suppressors are thrown under the bus too. Bump stocks were never officially named as being used in the Vegas shooting. Government coverup. Ban bump stocks to make the commies happy. Suppressors are used more in crimes every year than bump stocks ever were.
You may or may not be done with this thread. However, why don't you consider being "done" with posting anonymously. If you are going to continue to spew your venom, then have the courage to do so under your real name. How about putting your real name and reputation behind your comments as I have done. Man up, tell us who you are and stop being a keyboard-Rambo. This is a request, not a demand, so I won't hold my breath.

Chas.
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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#67

Post by Charles L. Cotton » Sat Jun 08, 2019 8:46 pm

Bitter Clinger wrote:
Sat Jun 08, 2019 12:20 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 6:48 pm
Bitter Clinger wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 5:51 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:28 pm
Bitter Clinger wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 1:23 pm
Charles L. Cotton wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:27 pm
anygunanywhere wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:14 pm
carlson1 wrote:
Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:06 pm
jason812 wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:39 pm
The Annoyed Man wrote:
Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:52 pm
They can ban them all they want. It will seriously tick me off, but it won’t stop me from having one if I want one. I know where to buy solvent traps, and I know how to make a suppressor. My son is a very highly qualified machinist. Making our own parts off the books is not a problem....if we have to.
:iagree:
They are not hard to make. Even easier if you have the right tools and know how to use them. :coolgleamA:

Bump stocks were not a sword to die on, are suppressors?
Bump stocks not worth dying for, suppressors not worth dying for, low round magazines not worth dying for, ammo not worth dying for, carrying a firearm outside your house not worth dying for, etc.... where do we say NO?
At the rate our 2A rights are slowly being eroded, we are dying a death of 1000 cuts. It is time the other side gets cut. Multiple times. Our side is tired of losing. And don’t even say the word compromise.
You say that "our 2A rights are slowly being eroded, . . ." Please list the specific erosion(s) you mean. Generalizations are easy to state, but I'm interested in the specific laws/restrictions.

Chas.
Not only did I fill out the forms, pay the $200 tax and wait months to be able to bail my SBR out of the safe at my FFL, but now I need to submit a properly filled out form to the ATF and wait weeks for permission to take my SBR across state lines to attend a training clinic. What part of shall not be infringed am I enjoying right about now?
So your version of a "slow erosion" ended in 1934.

Chas.
FIFY. "So your version of a "slow erosion" began in 1934". :tiphat:
Nice try, but no cigar. Only you and Anygunanywhere are claiming there is an erosion of Second Amendment rights. When asked to list the events that are part of that erosion, each of you could list only one law. Yours dates back to 1934. Erosion is a process, not a single event. More pro-gun bills than anti-gun bills have been passed at the federal level. We've done much better at the state level in many states, but that's just the difference in the makeup of Congress. My point is simply that overstating a problem doesn't help solve it; it simply destroys your credibility.

Chas.
To the extent that we do not enjoy Constitutional Carry in all 50 states, there has clearly been an erosion of rights. This does not take way from the very real efforts made to re-gain, but to deny erosion is simply playing lawyerly semantics.
No lawyerly semantics at play here, just a clear reading of the dictionary. "Erosion" is a continuing process and there is no erosion at either the federal level or in most states. There are states that are experiencing an erosion of gun rights like California, New Jersey, New York just to name a few. But that does not constitute a country-wide erosion anymore than one could claim that flooding in the Texas gulf coast constitutes flooding throughout the U.S.

I'll even agree that overall in the country, there was a time when gun rights were being eroding and this created the status quo that exists to some greater or lesser degree in all states. But the trend over the last 40 years has been to regain Second Amendment rights, not experience further erosion. If you are interested in why I took issue with AnygunAnywhere's "erosion" comment, then read my prior post responding to his latest comments.

If most American gun owners were of the gloom-and-doom ilk who deny progress, falsely accuse Second Amendment advocates and operatives of selling out and generally spew their crap, then I would have walked away from this fight decades ago. They aren't worth 5 minutes of my life, much less 40 years. Thankfully, such people make up a tiny fraction of American gun owners who, by and large, are honorable people who appreciate the work that has been done on their behalf. They don't make false allegations about the status of current gun laws, they don't lie about the NRA and they don't engage in spewing gloom-and-doom garbage. They also don't expect every wrong to be righted overnight and they appreciate progress even when it does not come at a pace we all would prefer.

Chas.
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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#68

Post by Liberty » Sat Jun 08, 2019 9:52 pm

I moved to Texas in the fall of 1988. At the time I could purchase a sidearm, but it was pretty much illegal, for me to take my handgun out into the world. Today law just about respecting individual can carry in their vehicle. in 1996 the right to conceal carry was allowed with a permit. The license fee was around $140 plus 8 hours of classroom. My class cost an additional $100, The license had to be renewed every 5 years. for an additional $140. and another class. Since then the places we can carry have been increased. Renewal classes have been eliminated. Online application and renewal have made things simpler. Discounts and renewal fees have decreased. We used to have to be very prudent about concealing. Today open carry is now a thing. At one time I was required to lock up my weapon and even separate my ammo when traveling out of state. Today I can carry in about 35 states. While there, I am free to carry in some incredible national and state parks. Today I own a kewl AR15 and I didn't have to go through any legal hoops to purchase it.

I am disappointed that we haven't made progress on a few things, but if what we have is erosion, I hope we get more of it. I am concerned by some of the reports that we have heard of the NRA, but I have full confidence that if it is broken, that it will be fixed. They are staffed by some good people and a board that will do the right things.
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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#69

Post by Texas_Blaze » Sun Jun 09, 2019 9:54 pm

I don’t know anyone on this board. I certainly don’t know anygunanywhere but over the years that I been on this board he doesn’t appear like keyboard Rambo fella to me at all. He strikes me as a fella that just likes liberty. Maybe he’s like me, feels betrayed by NRA and Trump with respect to firearms rules / laws. I can’t speak for him but I don’t like the in-fighting at all. It’s easy to criticize leaders. I do it. We all do it. I try to consider their pressures. I ain’t a leader of nuthin now. Not at church, not at work but I have been many years before. It’s not easy to lead. To make strategic decisions. I understand that. But from this side of things, all I see is infringing by the so-called protectors of gun rights. It is frustrating and angering. Especially since it is by people that you trusted. So, that makes the erosion, to me at least, feel much more real. I expect fights with libs and anti-gunners but when your own defenders turn on you, that feels like erosion to me. Takes a long time to build a good reputation but only a moment to destroy it. Same goes with trust.

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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#70

Post by Liberty » Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:54 am

Texas_Blaze wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 9:54 pm
I don’t know anyone on this board. I certainly don’t know anygunanywhere but over the years that I been on this board he doesn’t appear like keyboard Rambo fella to me at all. He strikes me as a fella that just likes liberty. Maybe he’s like me, feels betrayed by NRA and Trump with respect to firearms rules / laws. I can’t speak for him but I don’t like the in-fighting at all. It’s easy to criticize leaders. I do it. We all do it. I try to consider their pressures. I ain’t a leader of nuthin now. Not at church, not at work but I have been many years before. It’s not easy to lead. To make strategic decisions. I understand that. But from this side of things, all I see is infringing by the so-called protectors of gun rights. It is frustrating and angering. Especially since it is by people that you trusted. So, that makes the erosion, to me at least, feel much more real. I expect fights with libs and anti-gunners but when your own defenders turn on you, that feels like erosion to me. Takes a long time to build a good reputation but only a moment to destroy it. Same goes with trust.
We as humans tend to see the bad things in life and forget the good things that happen. Fer Instance:

Young people really believe that we live in the worst of time. That we are destroying the planet and are on the verge of destroying the planet. That poverty is ripping us apart and the poor get poorer. The young believe that the future is bleak and that they have come into this life at the worst of times.
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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#71

Post by Liberty » Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:09 am

Texas_Blaze wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 9:54 pm
I don’t know anyone on this board. I certainly don’t know anygunanywhere but over the years that I been on this board he doesn’t appear like keyboard Rambo fella to me at all. He strikes me as a fella that just likes liberty. Maybe he’s like me, feels betrayed by NRA and Trump with respect to firearms rules / laws. I can’t speak for him but I don’t like the in-fighting at all. It’s easy to criticize leaders. I do it. We all do it. I try to consider their pressures. I ain’t a leader of nuthin now. Not at church, not at work but I have been many years before. It’s not easy to lead. To make strategic decisions. I understand that. But from this side of things, all I see is infringing by the so-called protectors of gun rights. It is frustrating and angering. Especially since it is by people that you trusted. So, that makes the erosion, to me at least, feel much more real. I expect fights with libs and anti-gunners but when your own defenders turn on you, that feels like erosion to me. Takes a long time to build a good reputation but only a moment to destroy it. Same goes with trust.
We as humans tend to see the bad things in life and forget the good things that happen. Fer Instance:

Young people really believe that we live in the worst of time. That we are destroying the planet and are on the verge of destroying the planet. That poverty is ripping us apart and the poor get poorer. The young believe that the future is bleak and that they have come into this life at the worst of times.

The truth is the entire planet is more at peace than it has ever been. The danger of immediate nuclear devastation is probably at a 50 year low. World wide hunger is down and what we call poverty is pretty good living by historic standards. We have made some devasting diseases like Malaria and polio go away, and curing more cases of cancer every year. This generation grows up without a threat of the draft. While the planet, our air, and waterways are cleaner than they were 100 years ago. The pessimist's voice is louder and more persistent than the optimist.
Liberty''s Blog
"Today, we need a nation of Minutemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom." John F. Kennedy

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Liberty
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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#72

Post by Liberty » Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:09 am

Texas_Blaze wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 9:54 pm
I don’t know anyone on this board. I certainly don’t know anygunanywhere but over the years that I been on this board he doesn’t appear like keyboard Rambo fella to me at all. He strikes me as a fella that just likes liberty. Maybe he’s like me, feels betrayed by NRA and Trump with respect to firearms rules / laws. I can’t speak for him but I don’t like the in-fighting at all. It’s easy to criticize leaders. I do it. We all do it. I try to consider their pressures. I ain’t a leader of nuthin now. Not at church, not at work but I have been many years before. It’s not easy to lead. To make strategic decisions. I understand that. But from this side of things, all I see is infringing by the so-called protectors of gun rights. It is frustrating and angering. Especially since it is by people that you trusted. So, that makes the erosion, to me at least, feel much more real. I expect fights with libs and anti-gunners but when your own defenders turn on you, that feels like erosion to me. Takes a long time to build a good reputation but only a moment to destroy it. Same goes with trust.
We as humans tend to see the bad things in life and forget the good things that happen. Fer Instance:

Young people really believe that we live in the worst of time. That we are destroying the planet and are on the verge of destroying the planet. That poverty is ripping us apart and the poor get poorer. The young believe that the future is bleak and that they have come into this life at the worst of times.

The truth is the entire planet is more at peace than it has ever been. The danger of immediate nuclear devastation is probably at a 50 year low. World wide hunger is down and what we call poverty is pretty good living by historic standards. We have made some devasting diseases like Malaria and polio go away, and curing more cases of cancer every year. This generation grows up without a threat of the draft. While the planet, our air, and waterways are cleaner than they were 100 years ago. The pessimist's voice is louder and more persistent than the optimist.

Most of this so called new perceived infringing going on is not so real. We have made a lot of headway. I believe some of us are seeing an increase in the attacks on our freedoms and are interpreting these attacks as actual infringements. They don't recognize that the attacks have been pretty much unsuccessful. The reason that the attacks have become more frequent and outrageous is simply because we have been so successful.
Liberty''s Blog
"Today, we need a nation of Minutemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom." John F. Kennedy

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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#73

Post by Liberty » Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:19 am

Texas_Blaze wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 9:54 pm
I don’t know anyone on this board. I certainly don’t know anygunanywhere but over the years that I been on this board he doesn’t appear like keyboard Rambo fella to me at all. He strikes me as a fella that just likes liberty. Maybe he’s like me, feels betrayed by NRA and Trump with respect to firearms rules / laws. I can’t speak for him but I don’t like the in-fighting at all. It’s easy to criticize leaders. I do it. We all do it. I try to consider their pressures. I ain’t a leader of nuthin now. Not at church, not at work but I have been many years before. It’s not easy to lead. To make strategic decisions. I understand that. But from this side of things, all I see is infringing by the so-called protectors of gun rights. It is frustrating and angering. Especially since it is by people that you trusted. So, that makes the erosion, to me at least, feel much more real. I expect fights with libs and anti-gunners but when your own defenders turn on you, that feels like erosion to me. Takes a long time to build a good reputation but only a moment to destroy it. Same goes with trust.
We as humans tend to see the bad things in life and forget the good things that happen. Fer Instance:

Young people really believe that we live in the worst of time. That we are destroying the planet and are on the verge of destroying the planet. That poverty is ripping us apart and the poor get poorer. The young believe that the future is bleak and that they have come into this life at the worst of times.

The truth is the entire planet is more at peace than it has ever been. The danger of immediate nuclear devastation is probably at a 50 year low. World wide hunger is down and what we call poverty is pretty good living by historic standards. We have made some devasting diseases like Malaria and polio go away, and curing more cases of cancer every year. This generation grows up without a threat of the draft. While the planet, our air, and waterways are cleaner than they were 100 years ago. The pessimist's voice is louder and more persistent than the optimist.

Most of this so called new perceived infringing going on is not so real. We have made a lot of headway. I believe some of us are seeing an increase in the attacks on our freedoms and are interpreting these attacks as actual infringements. They don't recognize that the attacks have been pretty much unsuccessful. The reason that the attacks have become more frequent and outrageous is simply because we have been so successful.

Look at how far we have come in the past 30 Years. Try to see where we have come from and where we are headed.
Liberty''s Blog
"Today, we need a nation of Minutemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom." John F. Kennedy

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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#74

Post by bblhd672 » Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:17 am

If Democrats take the Senate, retain the House and win the Presidency in 2020, all bets are off. Don’t expect a majority Democrat Senate to be bound by silly outdated “rules” requiring 60 votes to get legislation passed restricting anything the progressive socialists want.
There’s 590 days until next president takes office, either Trump or a Democrat. Prepare accordingly.
The left lies about everything. Truth is a liberal value, and truth is a conservative value, but it has never been a left-wing value. People on the left say whatever advances their immediate agenda. Power is their moral lodestar; therefore, truth is always subservient to it. - Dennis Prager


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Re: Trump: Banning Suppressors?

#75

Post by jb2012 » Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:42 am

Trump’s admin just released a brief to the supreme court on it’s 2A views. To sum it up very briefly they defined silencers or suppressors as “dangerous and unusual weapons.” A suppressor/silencer is neither a weapon, nor dangerous and/or unusual.

Talk about a 180 flip on views when compared to running for election.

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