"No weapons" in employee manual = given notice???

bluelineman · Post by **bluelineman** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:32 pm

Does a "no weapons" policy (they included licensed people too) in an employee manual constitute effective notice under either 30.06 OR 30.05???

Would this be considered an arrestable offense? Or is it only an offense if you refuse to leave after they tell you to do so? Can you be arrested even if you agree to leave?

I'm not worried about the policy itself just the law.

Thanks!

lawrnk · Post by **lawrnk** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:39 pm

Does the company make you sign anything saying you have read or agree to the manual?

nitrogen · Post by **nitrogen** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:42 pm

lawrnk wrote:Does the company make you sign anything saying you have read or agree to the manual?

Doesn't matter, at least as far as Trespass by CHL holder goes.

If the written notice doesn't conform to the requirements of 30.06, they can't bring criminal charges against you.

They can still can you, though.

More troubling would be signing something that says that "The company policies were explained in depth to you."
That could possibly be a loophole. (Is that what you meant to say?)

bluelineman · Post by **bluelineman** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:47 pm

lawrnk wrote:Does the company make you sign anything saying you have read or agree to the manual?

Yes. You sign saying that you understand the policies. It is broken up into categories. They have you sign the last page of each section.

bluelineman · Post by **bluelineman** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:50 pm

nitrogen wrote:If the written notice doesn't conform to the requirements of 30.06, they can't bring criminal charges against you.

They can still can you, though.

More troubling would be signing something that says that "The company policies were explained in depth to you."
That could possibly be a loophole. (Is that what you meant to say?)

For purposes of 30.05 -

Would this be considered an arrestable offense? Or is it only an offense if you refuse to leave after they tell you to do so? Can you be arrested even if you agree to leave?

stevie_d_64 · Post by **stevie_d_64** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 7:53 pm

lawrnk wrote:Does the company make you sign anything saying you have read or agree to the manual?

They will make me sign something Monday at a new company I am going to go work at...

The verbage in the manual, is no where near a 30.06 notice, nor should it be, but I believe in respecting that notice (mainly because they are going to pay me more money than I have ever made before in my carreer) so I am going to play my cards very close to my chest...Yeah I know, I'm an oak!

But as I have said in previous discussions about this, I have ways to keep this from being an issue...

- not going to talk about guns, hunting, shooting incidents, the NRA, gun-control pro or con, politics, elections, politicians or candidates...

I feel it may make the day go by faster...

I know it eats me up inside, but in todays employment world...Most places you have to work at just plain stink, but the moneys good, so the last laugh is mine...

So I am planning on not giving anyone there a reason to say something where they might consider searching my vehicle...They are rather specific about what they think they can do about that...And the solution I have is well documented on how I plan to keep my self safe dispite their prejudice and discriminatory policy...

I'm talkin' bout a lot of money...And Steve looks good in Armani...So thats where I am on this...

What I will continue to fight for and support is getting that "employer parking lot" exemption bill through in 2009...

Then all of this becomes a moot point...

lawrnk · Post by **lawrnk** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 8:27 pm

nitrogen wrote:
lawrnk wrote:Does the company make you sign anything saying you have read or agree to the manual?
Doesn't matter, at least as far as Trespass by CHL holder goes.

If the written notice doesn't conform to the requirements of 30.06, they can't bring criminal charges against you.

They can still can you, though.

More troubling would be signing something that says that "The company policies were explained in depth to you."
That could possibly be a loophole. (Is that what you meant to say?)

I meant he likely would not faces charges, but could be fired.

Post by **Skiprr** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 10:14 pm

bluelineman wrote:
nitrogen wrote:If the written notice doesn't conform to the requirements of 30.06, they can't bring criminal charges against you.

They can still can you, though.

More troubling would be signing something that says that "The company policies were explained in depth to you."
That could possibly be a loophole. (Is that what you meant to say?)
For purposes of 30.05 -

Would this be considered an arrestable offense? Or is it only an offense if you refuse to leave after they tell you to do so? Can you be arrested even if you agree to leave?

IANAL, but 30.05 isn't applicable, unless you don't have a Texas CHL.

If you're trespassing on purpose, CHL or no, I'll let the Sheriff take care of it.

If you signed an acknowledgment with your employer that you have been told no firearms are allowed in the workplace, then you have been "served." You have been given notice under 30.06.

"What" you have been told does NOT have to conform to the 30.06 wording. If your employer has told you orally--or through a document or online instruction that you have signified agreement to--that you cannot bring a firearm onto the premises, then you are in legal liability if you do so.

Yep. You can be arrested.

Post by **Skiprr** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 10:24 pm

Stevie D, welcome to the no-carry-at-work club.

Adjust, adapt, overcome.

WarHawk-AVG · Post by **WarHawk-AVG** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 10:54 pm

Question:

Company has a no weapons policy, you MUST sign the "Code of Business Conduct"..its a requirement

The company reserves the right to search your vehicle in the parking lot, however does NOT honor the fact that your car was broken into/vadalized/stolen they or their insurance is responsible

Other (lets call them garages) have enclosed fenced in areas where you must scan a badge to get in...this particular building has a HUGE wide open parking area

What I am saying is..they consider the parkinglot "company property" and it gives them the right to search your vehicle..but when your car gets broken into or stolen they shrug their shoulders and say too bad so sad

Can they have it both ways or is that a violation of some sort

I fully understand going "into the building" but in the wide open ungated/protected parkinglot?

bluelineman · Post by **bluelineman** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:05 pm

I do have a CHL by the way.

There will be no parking lot issues in my case.

kauboy · Post by **kauboy** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 6:29 pm

I'm pretty sure that anything you sign simply means that you understand that they can, and probably will, fire you for violating any guidelines therein.

For officers to show up and arrest you, you would have to have committed a crime.
As far as 30.06 goes, you only commit a crime if you are carrying under CHL and if:
A.) you have been given verbal notice that no guns are allowed
B.) you have been presented with any document or handbook with the exact wording present in 30.06(format does NOT have to be met when in the form of a document or handbook)
c.) a sign is posted on the premises that has the exact wording and format stated in 30.06

Even if you sign something with the blanket "No firearms" statement, that will NOT holdup on 30.06 charges. Any decent lawyer should be able to beat this, if you ever get to that point of course.

BTW, my company's online manual says no weapons, but guess what's with me everyday, all day

bluelineman · Post by **bluelineman** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 7:45 pm

Thanks for the replies!

flb_78 · Post by **flb_78** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 9:20 pm

kauboy wrote:I'm pretty sure that anything you sign simply means that you understand that they can, and probably will, fire you for violating any guidelines therein.

For officers to show up and arrest you, you would have to have committed a crime.
As far as 30.06 goes, you only commit a crime if you are carrying under CHL and if:
A.) you have been given verbal notice that no guns are allowed
B.) you have been presented with any document or handbook with the exact wording present in 30.06(format does NOT have to be met when in the form of a document or handbook)
c.) a sign is posted on the premises that has the exact wording and format stated in 30.06

Even if you sign something with the blanket "No firearms" statement, that will NOT holdup on 30.06 charges. Any decent lawyer should be able to beat this, if you ever get to that point of course.

+P

if you are told orally that there are no firearms allowed, or signed a document the you were "told" then you would be in violation. If you sign a document that you read and understand, then no, not in violation of the law. Also applicable to car carry.