sheep stories

[tboesche]

A while back someone posted a link to a couple "sheep" stories. I have the one by LTC Grossman. Can somebody post a link to the other one?


please?

[LedJedi]

[WarHawk-AVG]

That would be

The Parable of the sheep

On Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs - Dave Grossman

[tboesche]

THANK YOU!

[LedJedi]

thanks for posting that last :)

[jpierce30]

WOW!!
That really puts everything into perspective. Everyone should read this and pass it on. Reading this should help anyone riding the fence to see the light and want to make sure they protect thier own life and family.
Thanks for posting this article.
Jim

[DoubleJ]

personally, I think it's also important to recognize that simply because someone else may not have that capacity for violence, and thusly is a sheep, that they are not subservient.
I see the tendency for some of our "sheepdogs" to act like big macho, chest bumping neanderthals at times. Making fun of those who choose not to take that ultimate level of responsibility. I have friends who couldn't handle it. they just don't have the nuts and bolts to have that control. that's alright. doesn't make him/her less of a person to me. I have a friend who tells me, "Man, if I had a gun, I'm afraid I'd use it." Well, he's not ready to take that on to himself. me, I am. But some would like to tell my friend that he's meek, that he's not a man. Then in the same breath, they say, "Ah'm only gon' protect me, and mah own."
well, sir. good for you, but in my eyes, that does NOT make you a sheepdog. maybe for your family, you are, but in society's view, eh, not so much. and it certainly doesn't make you Better.

and that's fine. that's okay. but for THAT guy to run around and belittle the itsy bitsy sheep for being soooooo weak, well. that ain't cool.


but then again, that's just me.

[WildBill]

I have friends who couldn't handle it. they just don't have the nuts and bolts to have that control.

People in this forum talk about their right to bear arms. Those same people also have the right not to bears arms if they choose. That doesn't, necessarily, make them sheep or any other kind of subservient animal. Some people just don't want to own guns, use guns or carry guns. As long as they don't interfere with my right to do so, it's okay with me.

[aardwolf]

People have the right not to carry. I won't make fun of someone for making that choice. I have a firend who is a pacifist and that's his right. However, if someone won't make the effort to defend themself, I don't see why I should make any effort to defend them.

[Liberty]

People have the right not to carry. I won't make fun of someone for making that choice. I have a firend who is a pacifist and that's his right. However, if someone won't make the effort to defend themself, I don't see why I should make any effort to defend them.

Then you are not a sheepdog, with a bound duty to protect the sheep.

I never cared for that particular sheep parable anyway, I also prefer to believe that we as adults are responsible for the safety of our own selves and love ones. Not to to roaming dogs. Having had some some responsibility to protect citizens as a soldier and a firefighter, I and the people I worked with never thought of ourselves as protectors of the sheep and I see no relationship of this how this responsibility relates to having a piece of plastic and a handgun.

However, I don't throw out of hand all parables of sheep and men. My favorite happens to go something like:

The Lord is my shepherd; I shall not want. He maketh me to lie down in green pastures: he leadeth me beside the still waters. He restoreth my soul: he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake. Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me. Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over. Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the LORD for ever.

Such a tiny, yet powerful piece of literature written by a sheepherder.

[shootthesheet]

I have always had great respect for any person who chooses to be a pacifist after understanding what that decision truly means. It is much harder for a person to adapt pacifism and apply that to daily life than to fight back, which I believe is a humans natural reaction, if the opportunity arises in any given situation. It takes more strength than a normal person, without serious religious/philosophical beliefs, can handle. We as CHLs have a unique opportunity to see a small portion of what it must be like in that we must attempt to avoid conflict when possible. Not just in being aware but by not allowing our pride to escalate a situation to where we may be seen as a cause. Pride and strength are not the same thing. We choose to not allow ourselves and others to be harmed in our own way. Those few Pacifist I have known feel and do the same. They use themselves and sacrifice themselves, if necessary, to defend others or their own personal beliefs. It is a strength most of us are unwilling to test.

Now, a pacifist is not a sheep. By definition, at least my own, they have made an informed decision and know the consequences of that decision. A sheep is a person that doesn't make the decision to take the responsibility to defend themselves or others thru ignorance and/or the inability to admit that bad things happen to "good people". They ignore the truth so their lives aren't interrupted. They are the ones that are so surprised when "events" happen to them or close to them. It takes tragedy for a sheep to realize God does not keep "good people" from trouble when it conflicts with his will or that karma works well for personal change but doesn't keep anyone safe. That is my opinion

[DoubleJ]

I have always had great respect for any person who chooses to be a pacifist after understanding what that decision truly means. It is much harder for a person to adapt pacifism and apply that to daily life than to fight back, which I believe is a humans natural reaction, if the opportunity arises in any given situation. It takes more strength than a normal person, without serious religious/philosophical beliefs, can handle. We as CHLs have a unique opportunity to see a small portion of what it must be like in that we must attempt to avoid conflict when possible. Not just in being aware but by not allowing our pride to escalate a situation to where we may be seen as a cause. Pride and strength are not the same thing. We choose to not allow ourselves and others to be harmed in our own way. Those few Pacifist I have known feel and do the same. They use themselves and sacrifice themselves, if necessary, to defend others or their own personal beliefs. It is a strength most of us are unwilling to test.

That is one of the best posts I've ever read on here!

Now, a pacifist is not a sheep. By definition, at least my own, they have made an informed decision and know the consequences of that decision. A sheep is a person that doesn't make the decision to take the responsibility to defend themselves or others thru ignorance and/or the inability to admit that bad things happen to "good people". They ignore the truth so their lives aren't interrupted. They are the ones that are so surprised when "events" happen to them or close to them. It takes tragedy for a sheep to realize God does not keep "good people" from trouble when it conflicts with his will or that karma works well for personal change but doesn't keep anyone safe. That is my opinion

I want to disagree here, but just a little. I will definitely concede that most people who fall into the category of sheep can be defined as above. However, I am not so sure that all Sheep are completely oblivious.

Once again, I must reference some friends of mine. these two guys have gotten into some "stuff" throughout their friendship, and honestly not once was their interaction because of unattentiveness, nor "an inability to admit bad things happen to good people." But neither want to carry a gun. Does it put them at risk, sure. but to them, they simply don't wanna do it. they go too many places that are restricted to "us," and they do a lot of travel to "unfriendly" states.

On the pacifist side, though, oh, they fight back. they got jumped out in California leaving a NAMM show, fought back and even beat one of their assailants down, a third member of their group got shot in the melee, and they still don't carry. but when provoked, they don't sit idley by. They're not Pacifists, they just use other tools. Basically they are saying, to them, the risks outweigh the benefits.

Oh, believe me, I've talked to them about guns and stuff. They know where I stand, and how I am. shewt, they joke about me packing all the time. it's just part of our relationship.
I just don't think people can be pigeon-holed into Sheep/SheepDawg categories, without exploring those categories a bit.

[SkipB]

I would never compair people to animals. Take two men in their late teens, drafted into the Army and sent to fight a war in Vietnam in the early sixties. A year later both return home after serving in the same unit and seeing much action. One get's a great job in a Police Dept. Again serving and fits in and becomes a productive citizan. The other slowly slides into depression and goes from one job to another. Can't hold on to a job and finds out he is suffering from PTSD. Post being the big word there. How would you look at them and how would you catagory them in the sheep and sheepdog theory. Remember they both stood up and served their country. Now while you think of that where in there would you put those who didn't go and serve. My point is if you put people in a catagory which you believe is below you then just maybe you should stop and look inside yourself. My wife and I travel alot we both have our CHL and carry for our personal pretection. If another person needed help I would help wheather armed or not. I have two chrildren who are grown and live in their own homes and in their views one is very much conservative and the other very much liberal. Although one has liberal views she very much appreciates our 2nd Amendent and wants to take her CHL classes. She is also a good christain and a very good mother to our only grandchild. I love both of them the same and never put either in any catagory. Both vote their views and are part of the process and their both productive citizans. I can't ask for more of them. I try hard not to point a finger at others and place them below me. Unless of course they or one of the bad guys.

[WarHawk-AVG]

This business of being a sheep or a sheep dog is not a yes-no dichotomy. It is not an all-or-nothing, either-or choice. It is a matter of degrees, a continuum.

Please re-read the "Parable of the sheep"

You can choose to be a sheep (a regular every day person) but you also have your tools of the wolves ready if needed

You will be a sheep...but you will NOT be food