CHL and Frontier Days

[FightinAggieCHL]

Here's a little quote I thought y'all might enjoy from my Political Science textbook, Practicing Texas Politics. Enjoy:

In 1995, when the legislature legalized the carrying of concealed handguns by licensed owners, some people interpreted the action as another influence of frontier days, when many Texans carried concealed weapons or bore pistols openly in holsters. Two assumptions underlie the concealed weapons law: first, that Texans so not need to rely on law enforcement for protection and, second, that citizens of the Lone Star State have a right to possess and carry weapons. Gun-rights groups have helped to advance these presumptions. Today, shootings and other violence may be as common in Texas's inner cities and elsewhere as they were on the state's frontier in the nineteenth century.

I am trying to interpret this in such a way that is not completely anti-2A, but I'm having a tough time. From what I can understand, they are saying that Texas has reverted to the Wild West because of concealed handguns. Am I misinterpreting?

Let the discussion begin!

[seamusTX]

You are exactly right. The overall crime rate in Texas now is lower than it was 20 years ago. We just had a discussion of how few CHL holders commit crimes of any kind, particularly violent ones.Conversely, the criminals who cause most violent crime do not have CHLs and are not eligible to get one.

- Jim

[FightinAggieCHL]

My concern is that this text is spewing this kind of crap to people who are easily influenced. In light of the recent college shootings (including the ones last year), and then reading this garbage of how Texas is as bad as it was with Cowboys and Indians, what kind of conclusions do you suppose they will draw?

And we wonder why it's so hard to get people to support our 2A rights...

[LarryH]

Someone should point out to the "authors" the relative population numbers then and now.

Sure, you have more incidents, but you also have, to pull a number out of my left ear, over ten times as many people, so the per capita incident rate is much lower.

"There are liars, then there are big liars and, finally, there are statisticians."

You can use the same set of statistics to prove anything you want -- just leave out the ones that don't support your thesis.

[shaggydog]

[quote="FightinAggieCHL"]My concern is that this text is spewing this kind of crap to people who are easily influenced. /quote]

Ag - You will find that the "spewing" of this type of stuff is not an uncommon occurrence in a University atmosphere (even one as conservative as A&M).

As a Former Student (both undergraduate and graduate schools) and a former member of the Professional Staff (including teaching responsibilities), I can assure you that the majority of your professors do NOT adhere to conservative ideologies and have few reservations about interjecting their own philosophies into the course syllabus.

As a student you must research EVERYTHING. Do NOT take the word of your professors, or the texts, as absolute. One of the functions of the University is to give you the tools, and allow you the freedom, to learn i.e. to QUESTION.

Be ever vigilant to the possibility that the FACTS have been editorialized.

[Rex B]

I read something recently that purported to debunk the gun-slinging wild west stories.
The premise was that gunfights were relatively rare in the 19th century, probably more rare than in today's inner cities.
It drew a correlation to the increase in anti-gun laws and the rise in violent crime and armed robbery, later attenuated as CHL laws became common.

[AEA]

My concern is that this text is spewing this kind of crap to people who are easily influenced. /quote]

Ag - You will find that the "spewing" of this type of stuff is not an uncommon occurrence in a University atmosphere (even one as conservative as A&M).

As a Former Student (both undergraduate and graduate schools) and a former member of the Professional Staff (including teaching responsibilities), I can assure you that the majority of your professors do NOT adhere to conservative ideologies and have few reservations about interjecting their own philosophies into the course syllabus.

As a student you must research EVERYTHING. Do NOT take the word of your professors, or the texts, as absolute. One of the functions of the University is to give you the tools, and allow you the freedom, to learn i.e. to QUESTION.

Be ever vigilant to the possibility that the FACTS have been editorialized.

WOW....it HURT me to read that..........

You must be planning a Law Degree in the future?

Good points though!

[shaggydog]

You must be planning a Law Degree in the future?

I am waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay past starting another career at this point and besides, we have more than enough *cough* *mutter* *Charles isn't looking is he* lawyers around here.

I'll stick to the biomedical sciences if you please.

[jimlongley]

I find the references to the "wild west" quite interesting - it makes me wonder if they know what they are talking about.

The era that most associate with "the wild west" primarily took place in Missouri, Kansas, Nebraska, and the Dakotas, not really all that west, just west of the Mississippi, but in the imaginations of those who do not know, it becomes Texas, Arizona, and Colorado.

Those who do not know also do not realize that the murder and violent crime rates were higher in the big eastern cities at that same time as the putative era they are referring to with such expertise. NY City, Baltimore, DC, and Boston were dangerous places, and many of them already had their earliest gun control laws in place by then.

Of course in the real wild west, just about everyone was armed, or at least could be, which had the expected effect, not nearly as much violent crime.

It's much like referring to the "roaring twenties" as a gangster era, when once again the actual gangster era was a much shorter period of time than they think, and involved relatively few people.

My perspective is somewhat skewed by my family's long generations, my great grandfather fought in the "Civil War" and my grandmother grew up in the "old west" always referred to, so I heard tales of those days first hand.