Flying SWA to New Orleans

[MBGuy]

Has anyone flown Houston Hobby to New Orleans bringing their handgun? I'll be visiting my step-daughter there soon and was wondering about previous experiences. I checked the archives and found Southwest to be pretty good with the process, but being New Orleans is another world, was concerned about any potential trouble at that NO airport itself.

[nedmoore]

No experience with flying with a gun, but I would defiantly take a gun to N.O. My little brother was robbed at gunpoint there last March in the quarter. Got his rolex and cell phone.

[Charles L. Cotton]

I've flown all over with SWA and have never had a problem, but I have not flown to New Orleans in many years.

Chas.

[Keith B]

...., but I have not flown to New Orleans in many years.

Chas.

Smart man!!

SWA is very good on transport for firearms. I have a buddy that is a pilot and he has said just make sure to follow the SWA guidelines for transporting firearms and there should be no problem getting into any airport or them taking it on the flight.

[MBGuy]

Well, all went well. I prepared and printed out the TSA and SWA guidelines, but I didn't need them.

Out of hobby, I declared the firearm and she didn't bat an eye. She filled out the little card, I signed it and filled out the rest. She had me unlock the guncase and she just looked at it without touching it. I locked it back up, closed the suitcase, and I told her "So now I take it to the TSA?". She said no, it goes from here. "Really??". "Yes" she said. Okey Dokey....she put the suitcase on the conveyer belt behind her.

New Orleans............a whole other country. If it wasn't for the food, there wouldn't be one redeeming characteristic to that dump. I decared to the guy behind the counter, no reaction, same as Hobby. This time though, he had me pull the slide to show him that the chamber was empty. He nodded his approval, I locked, and he told me to take it to the TSA. I did, told them that it contained a firearm, and the TSA guy just said to stick around until they put it on the conveyer belt just in case they wanted to take a look at it after the X-ray machine. No problems.

No consistency whatsoever.......

One question though. Can you wear an empty holster on the plane? Not that there's much to gain, it just crossed my mind.

Now on to Louisville, Ky., via Continental out of Bush IAH.......

[Texasdoc]

Well next monday I will let you know how Delta Airline is from Austin and on my return the following Monday from Richmond Va. I have been told Delta is pretty much a gun Freindly Airline, I hope so.


I have flown to Louisvile about 5 years ago with a Rifle and had no problem coming in or leaving so I hope you have the same .

good luck .

Doc

[ELB]

One question though. Can you wear an empty holster on the plane? Not that there's much to gain, it just crossed my mind.

I've carried my Comp-Tac in my carry-on bag w/o problem, and put it on in the RR of the plane before landing. Most of the time tho, I just put in on top in my checked bag.

elb

[stevie_d_64]

It never ceases to amaze me at the actual inconsistancies in procedures, but after declaring the firearm filling out the paperwork locking that and the firearm back up and placing it all in your "checked" baggage...(see the following)

Can someone explain to me the need to put that whole bag through the x-ray machine at an available security point to the gates and then back to the ticket counter??? What if my bag doesn't fit through that x-ray opening??? hmmmm??? They know you have a "GUN!", so what is the advantage of x-raying the entire bag again???

I'm all for tightening up things at airports, but this is a bit melodramatic, and embarrasing...Unless that is the whole idea...Make it as un-palateble for those of us who wish to fly with a declared gun in their bags as abhoring as smoking is these days...

I would have liked to have asked that question when I used to fly on C**tin$$**l Airlines to Alabama on occasion, but at the time the TSA and other government agencies were kinda going through this phase, and I thought it best not to bust their chops about it, considering I look like a terrorist anyway...I'm such a rabble rouser...

But then again the tyrrany of good intentions has always out-witted common sense and personal freedoms...

(ohhhh, thats a good one...I need to write that one down...It'll go in my negative nancy chapter...)

[KBCraig]

It never ceases to amaze me at the actual inconsistancies in procedures, but after declaring the firearm filling out the paperwork locking that and the firearm back up and placing it all in your "checked" baggage...(see the following)

Can someone explain to me the need to put that whole bag through the x-ray machine at an available security point to the gates and then back to the ticket counter??? What if my bag doesn't fit through that x-ray opening??? hmmmm??? They know you have a "GUN!", so what is the advantage of x-raying the entire bag again???

Guns are not the only potential hazard (in checked bags they're not a hazard at all). If you didn't have to x-ray a bag that contains a declared firearm, it would be easy to just declare a firearm in the same bag that was packed full of C4 and a timer.

But I agree, there's little rhyme, reason, or consistency to airport security. I support getting the government out of it completely. The airlines have a big stake in security; let them handle it.

[jimlongley]

Can someone explain to me the need to put that whole bag through the x-ray machine at an available security point to the gates and then back to the ticket counter??? What if my bag doesn't fit through that x-ray opening??? hmmmm??? They know you have a "GUN!", so what is the advantage of x-raying the entire bag again???

I wish you would clarify the question a little, Steve, that doesn't sound like a procedure that I am familiar with, but I would be willing to try to explain the procedures as I remember them, now about two years away from TSA.

If you were checking in at a ticket counter where there was no x-ray machine immediately adjacent, as we used to have at Continental at Love Field, then your checked bags were taken to the nearest machine to be x-rayed, and then returned to the ticket counter to be loaded on the checked bag cart or belt. They were x-rayed because that is the most reliable means of detecting "artfully concealed" contraband, such as IEDs.

Bags that don't fit through the machine will be hand inspected, and you can request hand inspection if you have items that you are concerned may be harmed by some part of the process. Hand inspections involve using explosive detection equipment and careful observation.

When you say "again" above, I wonder if maybe you had an experience where a possible threat was identified in your bag, and it was re-x-rayed to determine if the actual item had been removed/found/examined. This is SOP when the item was not readily identifiable by the operator, computer, or bag inspector. I have done this kind of thing many times when I found more than one item that seemed to fit the profile that I was looking for, or if the item on the screen did not appear to be in the location identified.

I had one guy who was concerned that we might confiscate his Bowie knife, knowing they are illegal in TX, so he secreted it in the lining of his bag. We saw it on the x-ray and would have ignored it, but it was obscuring something that looked like a timer/switch/power supply and I had to find that. When I could not find the knife we ran the bag back through and it became obvious that I had removed the offending item, an innocent piece of test equipment, but the knife wasn't in the bag. The owner of the bag was asked and "admitted" what he had done, and we repacked the bag, told him not to worry about it and risk suspicion and just pack the knife the next time, we were not LEOs and could care less about knives in checked bags, just like guns.

[Bashful]

"Can someone explain to me the need to put that whole bag through the x-ray machine at an available security point to the gates and then back to the ticket counter??? What if my bag doesn't fit through that x-ray opening??? hmmmm??? They know you have a "GUN!", so what is the advantage of x-raying the entire bag again???"

Some of the smaller airports have their X-Ray machines in the public area of the terminal. After you checkin, you take your luggage to the TSA machine (NOT the passenger security checkpoint) and leave the luggage with them. They X-Ray it and it goes to the baggage area.

Larger airports, the X-Ray machines are in the baggage handeling areas... you don't see them after they accepted by the ticket agent.

[stevie_d_64]

Jim, Kevin, Bashful...

What I was getting at was basically, if you declare a firearm, and you are in compliance with the "airlines" procedures we all know and love...

I have had this nagging feeling that once you do that you are profiled automatically for additional scrutiny, just because...And if they are not capable of scrutinizing you further, there in lies the inconsistancy of the overall security push around the country, in my opinion...

Not that I am overly criticizing the effort, but at least get the story straight (to the flying public) from the get go...If I declare the firearm to the ticket clerk, it is visually confirmed that it is unloaded and in a container style they approve, why in some cases is that not enough, and that additional x-raying is necessary (in some facilities and jurisdictions)???

Try this as a PSA...

The TSA and the airline industry support law abiding citizens that declare firearms to be carried in their checked baggage to be a valuable and welcome right in that regard, and that we appreciate the patience of those customers if at certain times, and only if the time and opportunity is available, to run that property through our detection screeners to provide a valuable training opportunity for them in a real-time and equipment environment in our nations airport facilities...

We know that this segment of our flying public would understand this effort is to maintain the highest level of readiness and safety of our nations airways to help us detect those who do not follow these rules and regulations, and do not hold the public or nations security interests in the highest regard.

---------------------------------

I know thats a lot of fluff, but I figure its a lot straighter story, if that really was the reasoning...I just believe it more that they are once again busting chops where it doesn't need to be busted...

But heck, I don't fly anymore regularly anyway...And if I did, it probably wouldn't be somewhere where my RKBA would be honored anyway...They had just better have a decent massage and adult beverages waiting for me at that destination...

[Bashful]

I don't know if it's 'additional' scrutiny or not... all bags are xrayed before they're placed on the plane. I fly 50-60 times a year... sometimes with my handgun... sometimes without. Flying from George Bush and from Hobby, I've never been held or questioned about my firearm. The only 'difference' has been the inspection at declaration, and being asked to wait about 5 minutes before going through the passenger security check point. Drop the baggage at the ticket counter... fill out the paperwork... and wait 5 minutes or so, and go through security with my carry-on.

Recently, I flew to Pensacola 4 times in a three week timeframe. Two times with a handgun, two times without. At Pensacola, their baggage Xray machine is in the ticket area, and all luggage goes throught them. So I and everyone else in the terminal went to the nearest Xray machine to leave our stuff with TSA. I stick around long enough to watch my bag come out of the Xray and disappear behind the wall.

The only 'trouble' I've had is when I had a couple of 9mm shells in the bottom of my carry on. That was a bit ugly... but that's a different story.

[jimlongley]

I have had this nagging feeling that once you do that you are profiled automatically for additional scrutiny, just because...And if they are not capable of scrutinizing you further, there in lies the inconsistancy of the overall security push around the country, in my opinion...

Well, I can assure you of this much - no one who checks a firearm is identified for additional scrutiny in any way that I know of. In the time I spent at TSA I was never able to tell, from a passenger's boarding pass, that they had checked a firearm. Yes, some people do get identified for additional scrutiny based on certain parameters - if they paid cash for a ticket, if the flight was ticketed less than 24 hours before departure, if they were unable or unwilling to provide proper ID, and a couple of other things (like watch lists) and those people get special marks on their boarding passes, plus a random selection of people.

Our usual procedure was to have the bag with the gun put on the belt by the ticket agent, and the agent would ask the person to step over to a window next to the baggage screening area to be able to unlock the bag if necessary. If the bag cleared there was no other question except for the interest of "gunnies" like myself who might want to see if they could identify a particular gun by its x-ray profile, and no special marks on the bag or boarding pass to identify that there was a gun in it. Depending on the size of the airport, as remarked above, the procedure will vary somewhat.

This might be a good place to point out that since the boarding pass and baggage receipt carry the same information, making a special mark on the boarding pass would also carry on to the bag and would be a violation of policy if not laws against identifying bags with guns in them externally. Unscrupulous people would soon find out what those marks were and steal guns that way.

Also, some airports are too small to have x-ray equipment so tthe bags there are always hand checked.

[ELB]

'Nother data point:

I've flown a number of times with firearms, and I cannot remember a single time that I had any more scrutiny once I dropped off the bag. I do remember getting an extra patdown several times in the year or two following the WTC/Pentagon attacks, when I had no firearms, and was still on active duty to boot.

Occasionally when I drop off a bag (and wait while it goes thru the machine), the TSA guy wants to look in the bag, even more rarely in the locked gunbox. There was never any problem with this, he said he just wanted to see what some other item was wasn't obviously identifiable on the X-ray.

elb