Pocket knives in court

[tarkus]

I know 46.03 prohibits carrying an "illegal knife" "on the premises of any government court or offices utilized by the court" but a normal pocket knife (4" blade) is not an "illegal knife" (otherwise it would be a crime to carry walking down the street.)

Are there any laws against carrying a pocket knife in a courthouse? Schools? Polling places?

[smyrna]

I don't think it's against the law, but most court houses that I've been in recently have a deputy and a walk through metal detector. You will NOT get through with a blade of any length at least in Harrison, Gregg or Smith county.

I can remember some years ago when I first noticed the metal detectors...I tossed my keys along with the Kershaw into the basket and got the look from the deputy. Well, he was understanding of my casualness but he held the knife until I exited. Since then (and 9/11), I don't even try it...it stays in the car.

Schools and polling places...I know of no such laws prohibiting possesion of a legal knife. However, most schools try to regulate possesion by students at the local level.

[tarkus]

I know about the metal detectors. If they notice it they can stop you from bringing it in, but is it a crime if you get a legal pocket knife past the checkpoint, intentionally or accidentally?

What about pepper spray?

[Luggo1]

Ditto what smyrna said. The judges I know will chew a baliff or courtroom officer royally if they let a pen knife through, much less a Bowie knife. It isn't worth it usually and you definitely don't want the bailiff telling the Judge or coordinator that you have been difficult in the security process especially if you are a litigant. I'm familiar with Bowie, Cass, Titus, Red River...northeast Texas basically as well as the panhandle pretty much the same everywhere with different levels of technology.

[dave_in_austin]

I have always been curious as to what the legal basis is that gives controllers of a public building the ability to regulate what a person may or may not bring into the building. I can understand how this works for private property, but where does the authority come from for public buildings? Any of you legal people care to comment?

[KC5AV]

I don't think it's against the law, but most court houses that I've been in recently have a deputy and a walk through metal detector. You will NOT get through with a blade of any length at least in Harrison, Gregg or Smith county.

I can remember some years ago when I first noticed the metal detectors...I tossed my keys along with the Kershaw into the basket and got the look from the deputy. Well, he was understanding of my casualness but he held the knife until I exited. Since then (and 9/11), I don't even try it...it stays in the car.

Schools and polling places...I know of no such laws prohibiting possesion of a legal knife. However, most schools try to regulate possesion by students at the local level.

Yeah, the guardian of the gate at the Harrison county courthouse told me that I'm not allowed to take my pocket knife in, and neither is anyone else. It keeps everyone safe that way. I didn't have time to tell her how naive she is.

[smyrna]

I have always been curious as to what the legal basis is that gives controllers of a public building the ability to regulate what a person may or may not bring into the building. I can understand how this works for private property, but where does the authority come from for public buildings? Any of you legal people care to comment?

IANAL but as far as schools go, case law has set precedents governing the rights of students and what schools may or may not enforce. The precedent of case law can be as powerful as any law in the books. For example, you and I are gauranteed our 4th Amendement rights against unlawful searches and siezures within the boundaries of "probable cause"; however, case law has set a precedent of "reasonable cause" (a lesser degree of cause) when dealing with students within the public school setting. So, students DO NOT have the same degree of protection of the 4th Amendment as you and I, at least not while in the public school setting.

My guess is that the court house situation is much the same; set by precedent whether or not it is in the books.

[KBCraig]

Bowie County has a special addition to their "no weapons" sign: "No knives, including pocket knives."

It's rather silly, especially since 90% of the traffic in the courthouse has nothing to do with the courts.

[striker55]

I was on jury duty a couple weeks ago in Harris County, the deputy who lead our group asked if anyone had a pocket knife. One guy had one and the deputy took it and put it in his pocket. He gave it back to the guy when his time was up (he did not get picked for duty, I did).

[thankGod]

The last time I was summoned for jury duty in Harris County you could be in the gathering room and there was no problem having a knife. However once I was picked for a jury panel and we were taken to the courthouse, then we had to empty our pockets into a basket and go through a metal detector. I carry a small Swiss Army pin knife (the smallest they make) and the officers kept it until I exited from the courthouse.

When inside the courthouse there were prisoners everywhere. They were ushered past the jurors or other civilians in the hallways (shackled and cuffed), and in very close contact with us. I assume the assumption is to remove prisoner temptation, and the potential of a prisoner to create a dangerous situation.

[Liko81]

Well, last time I was at the Richardson Municipal Courthouse (Which is totally surrounded by the city of Garland except that Richardson owns that block and Campbell Road leading up to it ) they didn't even have metal detectors. I can't remember having a knife on me when I was there but if I did, nobody cared. It's pretty small-time there though; you can bet the Dallas County Courthouse has metal detectors at every entrance.

[charlie]

The Brazoria County CH requires everyone to walk through a metal detector upon entry. Knives and other "weapons" are not allowed. The security deputies used to "store" your knife for you and would return it when you left. I guess the process beacame too burdonsome as they don't do that anymore. Being a mostly rural county everyone has a pocketknife. That's rapidly changing as Pearland, Manville and Alvin are undergoing exploding population growths. The rural flavor is changing.

Crime is too, especially in the north of the county as thugs from southern Houston burglarize and steal at the shopping malls.

The whole courthouse security thing started soon after 911. The Feds started throwing money at local governments to beef up security. Our Judges had always been worried as well, especially in family courts where things can become quite volatile. Shootings in courtrooms in other locales gave some concern too.

The feds paid for the metal detectors and we got them. Even employees arn't supposed to have knives, although I've never heard of one getting in trouble for a butterknife in the breakroom.

Thr presence of more meth heads and more hip hop looking thugs has folks spooked too.

[KBCraig]

Bowie County also screens with a walk-through detector immediately inside the front entrance.

"Special" people get to use the side entrance with a cardkey and bypass security. I presume they're court personnel, elected officials, and friends thereof. You know, the people actually using the court, instead of the 90% using the courthouse for non-court matters. All the peons have to get screened by the very bored deputy manning the detector.

I've always disarmed in the parking lot, but one time I forgot to leave my Victorinox "Classic" Swiss Army pen knife (the one with a 1.25" blade, a nail file, and scissors). I just put it in the basket with my change and dropped my cell phone on top, and picked it up on the other side.

I do give credit to Sheriff James Prince, though: the last time I was at the courthouse, he personally manned the entrance while the deputy was on his lunch break.

[jmorris]

When I went to the San Antonio Municipal Court building on S. Frio St., at the metal detector I had to place my pocket knife (2" blade), my baby multi-tool (1.75"), and my key chain with a Swiss Army SwissMemory knife (1.5") in a zip lock bag, for which a recieved a ticket stub. Returned the ticket and picked them up on the way out.

[barres]

The last time I had jury duty in Walker County, there were no metal detectors, and I am rather certain that I had my pocket knife in my pocket at the time (it's my version of the American Express card, I don't leave home without it). This was only about 2 or maybe 3 years ago.