Church carry or not?

[Fixintu]

I have searched high and low here on the forums and am finding conflicting statements. Is it CURRENTLY legal as a Texas CHL holder to carry in church?? I have seen some postings by folks saying they DO carry in church and that the law was changed to allow this but can find no posting from the penal code that reflects this. I went to the DPS website and downloaded the latest .PDF "TEXAS CONCEALED HANDGUN LAWS AND SELECTED STATUTES" dated October 2007
http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/ftp/forms/ls-16.pdf
and this is what I find:

PC w6.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE
HOLDER. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license
holder carries a handgun on or about the license holdets person
under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code,
and intentionally fails to conceal the handgun.
(b) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder intentionally,
knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority
of Subchapter H. Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of
whether the handgun is concealed, on or about the license holder's
person:[/b]
(1) on the premises of a business that has a permit or license issued
under Chapter 25,28,32,69, or 74, Alcoholic Beverage Code, if
the business derives 51 percent or more of its income from the sale or
service of alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption, as
determined by the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission under Section
104.06, Alcoholic Beverage Code;
(2) on the premises where a high school, collegiate, or professional
sporting event or interscholastic event is taking place, unless
the license holder is a participant in the event and a handgun is used
in the event;
(3) on the premises of a correctional facility;
(4) on the premises of a,hospital licensed under Chapter 241.
Health and Safety Code, or on the premises of a nursing home licensed
under Chapter 242, Health and Safety Code, unless the license
holder has written authorization of the hospital or nursing home
administration, as appropriate;
(5) in an amusement park; or
(6) on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other established
place of religious worship.

Am I missing something here? Are my search skills found lacking?

[Keith B]

Read on down to section (i) where they amended the statute to require 30.06 posted at churches, amusement parks, etc.
(i) Subsections (b)(4), (b)(5), (b)(6), and (c) do not apply if the actor was not given effective notice under Section 30.06.

I have searched high and low here on the forums and am finding conflicting statements. Is it CURRENTLY legal as a Texas CHL holder to carry in church?? I have seen some postings by folks saying they DO carry in church and that the law was changed to allow this but can find no posting from the penal code that reflects this. I went to the DPS website and downloaded the latest .PDF "TEXAS CONCEALED HANDGUN LAWS AND SELECTED STATUTES" dated October 2007
http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/ftp/forms/ls-16.pdf
and this is what I find:

PC w6.035. UNLAWFUL CARRYING OF HANDGUN BY LICENSE
HOLDER. (a) A license holder commits an offense if the license
holder carries a handgun on or about the license holdets person
under the authority of Subchapter H, Chapter 411, Government Code,
and intentionally fails to conceal the handgun.
(b) A license holder commits an offense if the license holder intentionally,
knowingly, or recklessly carries a handgun under the authority
of Subchapter H. Chapter 411, Government Code, regardless of
whether the handgun is concealed, on or about the license holder's
person:[/b]
(1) on the premises of a business that has a permit or license issued
under Chapter 25,28,32,69, or 74, Alcoholic Beverage Code, if
the business derives 51 percent or more of its income from the sale or
service of alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption, as
determined by the Texas Alcoholic Beverage Commission under Section
104.06, Alcoholic Beverage Code;
(2) on the premises where a high school, collegiate, or professional
sporting event or interscholastic event is taking place, unless
the license holder is a participant in the event and a handgun is used
in the event;
(3) on the premises of a correctional facility;
(4) on the premises of a,hospital licensed under Chapter 241.
Health and Safety Code, or on the premises of a nursing home licensed
under Chapter 242, Health and Safety Code, unless the license
holder has written authorization of the hospital or nursing home
administration, as appropriate;
(5) in an amusement park; or
(6) on the premises of a church, synagogue, or other established
place of religious worship.

Am I missing something here? Are my search skills found lacking?

[Fixintu]

Keith, once again you have pulled my keester out of the legal fog. Thank you! I guess I didn't read quite far enough.

[Keith B]

Don't feel like the Lone Ranger. TONS of others have missed that one. The state took the easy way out when they changed the law on church, amusement park, hospital and government meeting carry by just adding that blurb instead of changing the other verbiage.

[KaiserB]

As a follow up to this...here is a secondary question:

My church, holds service in a grade school building on Sundays. I assume it is ok to carry in church, but it gets sticky as the church service is held inside a school building.

Any thoughts?

[Keith B]

As a follow up to this...here is a secondary question:

My church, holds service in a grade school building on Sundays. I assume it is ok to carry in church, but it gets sticky as the church service is held inside a school building.

Any thoughts?

Off limits. It is still a school building. The statutes do not state anything about 'only when school is in session'

[Liko81]

As a follow up to this...here is a secondary question:

My church, holds service in a grade school building on Sundays. I assume it is ok to carry in church, but it gets sticky as the church service is held inside a school building.

Any thoughts?

Off limits. It is still a school building. The statutes do not state anything about 'only when school is in session'

Then does that mean that, for instance, if you attend church on the campus of a private university (i.e. St Ed's in Austin) or attend a church that operates a private school in an attached building, your church is off-limits with no signage required?

[Keith B]

Then does that mean that, for instance, if you attend church on the campus of a private university (i.e. St Ed's in Austin) or attend a church that operates a private school in an attached building, your church is off-limits with no signage required?

I think it would depend on on what the building's primary purpose is. If it is a church building, and not used as a 'school' classroom, then it should be legal. However, if it is owned by the school, then it may be construed to be the 'premises' of a school. Since there is no clear definition and no test cases, it is yet another one of those gray areas.

[shootthesheet]

I am glad the state does that. I know of a few anti-carry types that don't post signs because they don't understand the way the law is written. I have listened to their ignorance of the change and even agreed "It must be off limits then because there it is in black and white". That is why I think we could get universal school carry passed.

We get college carry early in 2009 and let the media go bananas over that. Then quietly pass universal school carry at the end of the session or in 2011. The public reaction would be that they either thought that it was still off limits in all but higher learning schools or had already been passed. I just wish we had some influential people on this board that could get something done about it. Of course that man, or woman, would be a true personal hero of mine if they could. I just wonder if anyone knows of a person that could do something like that.
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