Speed & Accuracy ???

[NORMAN]

Ok all you speed freaks out there I need some help. After watching one of the "shooting shows" the other night a guest instructor was asked to fire multiple shots at upper center mass of target. First a single shot, then a 4 shot burst (so you don't get caught in a pattern) All shots could be covered with a 50 cent piece. Ther appeared to be no muzzle flip etc. So here goes - How in the world do you shoot that fast and be that accurate ?? Are their guns tricked out, is ammo loaded minimums, etc ??? This is about to drive me crazy someone please help, I got to know !!!!

Thanks Guys

[WildBill]

The same way you get to Carnegie Hall. Practice, practice, practice.

[CompVest]

It is called practice and practice it correctly every time building speed as you go! The easiest way is to find a good IDPA or USPSA instructor. In answer to your equipment question: no you don't need any tricked out gun. I see this type of shooting from my husband frequently and he is shooting a stock M&P Pro. Gosh I have done it myself!

[jbirds1210]

A quote that my good friend Dave shared with me:

"You can't go fast, you can only be fast"

Practice until it feels like you are moving in slow motion.

I agree 100% with Compvest concerning equipment....use what you have and get good with it.

Jason

[WarHawk-AVG]

And light load your rounds so you get almost NO recoil

In a real firefight using full power ammo...that non-existent muzzle flip wouldn't be there

People "cheat" and reload their ammo light so it doesn't kick, but the round speeds suffer..that's why they made a rule in IDPA (I don't know it.but I know its there to prevent some person from light loading and just plinking his way thru) Its called the power floor rule.

It may be enough to punch a hole in paper..but nowhere near enough to stop a badguy

That's why I feel if you shoot competition..everyone should use the ammo you will use in a real firefight.

[tfrazier]

What I do is put the very first one close as I can to center mass, then shoot all the others completely off target. When the instructor looks at my target to score it, I just tell 'em I put every round through that same hole.

[tfrazier]

No longer blink at the gunshot??? That's physically possible?

I've watched lots of video of seasoned champion shooters and I think they blink every time a round goes off...I remember specifically watching their eyes, not necessarily looking for blinking, but it's interesting to see which ones still close one eye and which ones don't.

I'll pay even closer attention now to see if I can see any that don't blink. I'll be impressed.

[Skiprr]

That said (no, not what Timothy said; but the others ) I think there are some equipment factors involved, and they can be important considerations when choosing a primary handgun for concealed carry. If you pick up a stock G29 or G27 with a stock magazine (no extensions) and use standard factory ammo (no subsonics), my opinion is that even the very best shooters will have a hard time maintaining that sort of accuracy in rapid fire. They may come close in controlled-pair speed, but not in double-tap speed.

Very small pistols have become increasingly popular as the number of CCW holders grows nationally. Just a few decades ago, if you wanted a sub-compact sized pistol you were seldom looking at calibers even as large as .380. Today, you can get beefy calibers with good muzzle energy in very small pistols. The combination can make for a very attractive carry, but you'd better be prepared to practice a healthy amount with that combo and learn what you can and can't do with it. A lightweight, sub-compact pistol in 10mm or even .40 S&W doesn't give you much to hold onto, and doesn't put really any mass between you and the muzzle flip.

Then again, a 1.5-inch sized rapid-fire grouping at 10 yards isn't necessary for good combat accuracy. In general, though, a larger gun with a longer barrel will afford you a better potential for rapid-fire accuracy...basic accuracy, in fact. A longer sight radius means more precise aiming capability, and more mass and a longer mechanical action means less felt recoil.

I know this really doesn't have anything to do with your question, but I'm just notin' it for all the folks new to concealed carry who may be shopping for their first carry gun. Everything is a trade-off. Bigger guns are heavier and may be more difficult for some to conceal, but you can become more accurate with them in a shorter period of time (to a point: ain't talkin' totin' a S&W .500 Magnum here; but a Glock 17 is going to be easier to shoot well than a Glock 26). Small guns are easier to carry and conceal, but they're harder to use well. And if you put a snappy load like a 10mm in a very small pistol, you have some effective ballistics but a gun that may really bounce around on you between shots. I'm just sayin'.

Not back to your regularly scheduled programming...

[txfireguy2003]

You know, it's funny. I've always thought that the longer sight radius and heavier weapon made the full size weapons easier to handle and shoot well than the sub-compacts. That said, I shoot better with my G-27 than with my full size XD40. I get tighter groups, just as fast if not faster, and have less felt recoil (to my uncalibrated hands that is) from the Glock. Don't know why, but it's just what I am experiencing. No, when I drop down to my better half's M&P 9C, I can REALLY make some nice tight groups, and pretty dadgum fast too!

[CompVest]

txfireguy2003, what you said is exactly why there are so many different guns. What works for one shooter may not for another. It is also why it is best for a shooter to choose their own gun and not let someone else pick it for them.

I agree that the gun and ammo can make a difference as to accuracy and speed, but I don't think special light loads and tricked out guns are necessary. I have seen too many shooters capable of making a 1.5" group at speed at 10 yards with factory ammo and stock guns. The reloads I shoot are the same power factor as WWB. I think the key is good consistent practice of good shooting techniques done slowly over time to build accuracy and speed.

[NORMAN]

Thanks for the info so far but still need to dig deeper !! I think practice, practice, practice is has always been a given but practice what ???????????????
I know about trigger control etc. what about sight picture. Do you close one eye and focus on front sight with target blurry or focus on target with front sight with eyes open etc. Also watched some video other night on the indoor IDPA and couple of top pros seemed to have both eyes opened and no blink

[CompVest]

NORMAN, that is why in my original post I said get instruction from a good IDPA or USPSA instructor so you would know what to practice. This would give you grip, stance, sight picture, acquiring sight picture, managing recoil, staging the trigger, the draw, presentation of the gun towards the target the list goes on.

[WildBill]

NORMAN, that is why in my original post I said get instruction from a good IDPA or USPSA instructor so you would know what to practice. This would give you grip, stance, sight picture, acquiring sight picture, managing recoil, staging the trigger, the draw, presentation of the gun towards the target the list goes on.

Norman - My OP was not a completely flip answer. Practice is the key. My point is that there is no simple or quick way to obtain this kind of expertise. There is no magic bullet load, trick gun, secret trigger job or grip or stance that is going to teach you what you want to know. Listen to CompVest. She has been there.