Man indicted for shooting fleeing intruder

[seamusTX]

Here's another article that was published in 2007:

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/specia ... ction.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

He was a college kid. They never seem to have trouble getting booze. I didn't.

- Jim

[ladromar]

You guys need to watcht he movie "Felon" go rent it next time you feel like staying home and watching movies on a rainy evening.

It's about a hardworking business owner guy with a beautiful family who kills an intruder under the same circumstances.

Except he used a baseball bat...


Anyway; it will give you chills and a perspective in life and responding to a "threat" with deadly force.
(threat is under quotations because anyone fleeing from you is NOT threat in my book)

My .01 cent

[seamusTX]

... anyone fleeing from you is NOT threat in my book ...

That is generally the case.

A person who is running away from you can continue to be a threat. He might be running for cover so he can start shooting back.

That is why a defensive shooting that results in an attacker being shot in the back is sometimes justified (contrary to the TV western rules of combat). But you may have to prove it in court.

- Jim

[ladromar]

... anyone fleeing from you is NOT threat in my book ...

That is generally the case.

A person who is running away from you can continue to be a threat. He might be running for cover so he can start shooting back.

That is why a defensive shooting that results in an attacker being shot in the back is sometimes justified (contrary to the TV western rules of combat). But you may have to prove it in court.

- Jim

Absolutely; let me elaborate bit more.

Any UN-armed person fleeing away from you (not seeking cover, not looking around or reaching for a blunt weapon, firearm, or nuke bomb) is GENERALLY not a threat.

But you do have a point here:

"That is why a defensive shooting that results in an attacker being shot in the back is sometimes justified (contrary to the TV western rules of combat). But you may have to prove it in court"


So take my opinion with a grain of salt.

[seamusTX]

The defendant's trial started yesterday, nearly four years after the incident.

http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_ ... 046896.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

- Jim

[XinTX]

A few things missing that could be contributors here. Not justification mind you, only contributors:
1: Was the homeowner 5' 5" and 130# and the intruder 6' 6" 275#? That could have contributed to the 'fear factor' of the homeowner.
2: Were there any factors affecting the homeowner that would have raised his anxiety levels (threats, etc.)? Doubtful given the unlocked door.
3: Given how close the family of the intruder lived, was there any 'history' there?

But the homeowner did go over the top shooting a fleeing BG five times. Then again, to be startled awake in the middle of the night with the wife screaming, I'm sure the adrenaline kicked in on turbo at that point and logic took flight. But my instinct at that time would have been to put the intruder to flight and then fall back to provide defense for the wife. Had there been a second intruder, leaving to chase one taking flight would leave the family unprotected.

[seamusTX]

The homeowner explicitly stated that he was trying to hold the intruder until the police arrived. (What do they say about talking yourself into jail?)

You are right about staying in the house after the intruder fled. None of this unpleasantness would have happened if the homeowner had done that (or locked his door, or had a burglar alarm).

- Jim

[PUCKER]

Just throwing this out there....had the intruder NOT intruded....NONE of this would've happened. I know, a refreshing thought, eh?

[esxmarkc]

I can't see this turning out too well for Mr. Lemes. He better have the best defense attorney he can't even afford. Hopefully, his defense team won't allow ANY of the testimony relating to the fact that the guy just stumbled into the wrong house and wasn't likely a burglar/rapist/etc. The jury will have to see this from the perspective that Mr. Lemes saw it as he woke up to the screams of his wife then decide that the shooting the empty-handed fleeing intruder in the street was justified.

But I don't think it is going to happen.

I does bear many of the same elements to gemini's encounter here http://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=42878" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Glad gemini didn't hit the guy now. And I'm dang glad to read such encounters here and smarten up on how to react in certain situations.

In my younger days before I carried I tried to run down a car thief/burglar or two. I think that practice is over for me now.

[seamusTX]

Just throwing this out there....had the intruder NOT intruded....NONE of this would've happened.

The homeowner had little control over the intruder's actions except for locking his door.

I have found in life that the stupid or wrong actions of another person do not excuse my mistakes. This guy is finding the same fact.

- Jim

[XinTX]

I don't see it going well with this for him either. Even IF the criminal charges don't stick (and I think that's a BIG if) he will also face a civil liability where the Castle Doctrine (probably) won't apply. IANAL, so take it for what it's worth.

[function12]

Those sliding doors have led to a world of grief. Even when the lock is working as designed, it's flimsy.

Bracing devices are available, but a piece of wood cut to length would work as well. It doesn't need to be a 2 x 4. Probably a piece of PVC pipe would do.

People sometimes crash into those doors, too, thinking that they are open.

- Jim

That will not keep the door from being lifted out of the track. Simple easy fix is to drill a small hole through frame and into the door. (do not hit the glass). Then insert a nice 12D nail. This will keep the door in it place.

[speedsix]

...good tip...same goes for side-sliding windows...they lift out on many models unless "pinned"...

[nyj]

This is a good read for the guy over in the LEO contacts and bloopers forum.

http://texaschlforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=42878" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Ameer]

That will not keep the door from being lifted out of the track. Simple easy fix is to drill a small hole through frame and into the door. (do not hit the glass). Then insert a nice 12D nail. This will keep the door in it place.

That will not stop the criminal from breaking the glass.