No CHL required to carry under certain circumstances

[psehorne]

I think we may be discussing two separate points, so I will kick in with my opinions, while trying to clarify which of the two I am referring to.

Steve, thanks for the great summary.

I will offer one obvious correction. "Any person" excludes felons as

PC 6.04. UNLAWFUL POSSESSION OF FIREARM. (a) A person
who has been convicted of a felony...

explains.

[popgoesmypocket]

Can someone advise me of this:
You can go gun to car, then gun from car to business, and back...WITH GUN CONCEALED,,,no chl.

But, isnt there a law you can have a gun on your property...openly? meaning no need to conceal while getting in car in your own driveway?

Please advise.

[psehorne]

.. isnt there a law you can have a gun on your property...openly? meaning no need to conceal while getting in car in your own driveway?

No requirement to conceal on your property or while enroute to your vehicle.

PC 46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun, illegal knife, or club if the person is not:
(1) on the person's own premises or premises under the person's control; or
(2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle that is owned
by the person or under the person's control.

but there is a requirement to conceal once you are inside of your vehicle, as stated below

(a-I) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun in a
motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control at any time in which:
(1) the handgun is in plain view;
...

[KD5NRH]

In TX, you cannot open publicly unless while hunting or on your property, or your business, or your employer business *with his permission*.

46.15(b)(4) still allows carry enroute to lawful hunting, fishing, or other sporting activity as long as the weapon is of a type commonly used in the activity, with no specification as to open or concealed status.

I suppose, if one had plenty of time and money available, one could try walking or bicycling to the next SASS or PPC match while open carrying.

[Beiruty]

In TX, you cannot open publicly unless while hunting or on your property, or your business, or your employer business *with his permission*.

46.15(b)(4) still allows carry enroute to lawful hunting, fishing, or other sporting activity as long as the weapon is of a type commonly used in the activity, with no specification as to open or concealed status.

I suppose, if one had plenty of time and money available, one could try walking or bicycling to the next SASS or PPC match while open carrying.

I suppose:
If you are:
a) A registered and paying competitor in IPDA/IPSC
b) Active competitor with proven competition record in said sporting IDPA/IPSC
c) Already, pre-registered (in writing, or proof can be produced) in competitive match that is taking place on "matching date"

Then, if said actor (you) carried a said competition firearm (your CC firearm) openly or concealed with or without CHL,while traveling (walking, biking, riding on horse, or using his motor vehicle) from his usual place of residency to said competitive shooting match ground (range) the actor may argue and successfully prevail in court of law.

However, the actor may be arrested, and has to appear in court to prove a) b) c)

And I am not a lawyer, nor a judge. I like those discussion as it may reveal legal ways and means that we assume it is not. We have all the time to our legal rights.

[jsimmons]

Before this goes much futher, let me say this. I have found this forum to be very informative. I've felt very welcome. Many members have provided very useful information, life experiences, suggestions, and more. For that I am very thankful that I discovered TexasCHLForum.com

On the other hand, when it comes to law many opinions are expressed that are not based on fact, are based on the way the law used to be written, or on incomplete knowledge of the laws. I've been guilty myself of such (not necessarily on this forum). That is why, for each statement I have made, I have provided the excerpt from the Penal Code upon which my opinion is based.

If you make a statement, please back it up with the legal reference your statement is based upon. "Because it has always been that way" or "Because Mr. Upstanding Citizen said so and I know he knows the law" are not good enough.

So. Let's enjoy the dialogue... and hope that we all benefit from it....

My experience is that LEOs aren't interested in arguing semantics - especially in the field - and they generally go on their own interpretation of the law. You'll get cited, or worse, arrested if you do something they think is out of sorts, and your pistol will probably be confiscated. At that point, it's going to cost you a good chunk of change to get out from under the charge, and if you have a CHL, it will be at risk (not to mention making your renewal form that much more "interesting" to DPS). Asking non-lawyers for legal opinions or references is - well - stupid.

[KD5NRH]

I believe that even as a CHL, I may possibly be in violation of "concealment" if I lay my
Taurus on the seat while I am doing bidness at a driveup ATM.

Is hunting robbers over bait a sporting activity?

Beyond that, you could still be en route to a sporting activity, but with the change in the wording to include "directly," we'd still have to argue the point of whether stops incidental to the journey (e.g. getting gas, getting a flat tire fixed, withdrawing cash for your event registration fees, etc.) are still part of "directly en route."

[KD5NRH]

Asking non-lawyers for legal opinions or references is - well - stupid.

But it can be entertaining.

Not nearly as entertaining as getting three lawyers together at a table and asking them collectively for a legal opinion, though

[Liberty]

Asking non-lawyers for legal opinions or references is - well - stupid.

But it can be entertaining.

Not nearly as entertaining as getting three lawyers together at a table and asking them collectively for a legal opinion, though

There are non lawyers here who understand specific gun and self defense law better than most lawyers.and who can explain it to us mortals a lot better than the best of self defense lawyers. We have some very smart people in this group, and most aren't lawyers.

[srothstein]

Can someone advise me of this:
You can go gun to car, then gun from car to business, and back...WITH GUN CONCEALED,,,no chl.

But, isnt there a law you can have a gun on your property...openly? meaning no need to conceal while getting in car in your own driveway?

Please advise.

You are correct about the gun while on your property, but the law now specifically allows you to carry concealed to your car even if you do not park on your own property. Some of us park in the street, and some of us live in apartments. In either of those cases, you would have been leaving your property and breaking the law if this had not been included.

And as an aside, the law does not say "and back". If you completely comply with the law, your car is going to get very heavy from all the guns lef tin it eventually.

[wford]

The traveling definition was removed and most of its verbage was transferred to the latest 46.02

Thus you have notdefined...defined...notdefined... :)
I think there is case law on traveling but I dont have any details.

...there were those LEO's/DA who said they would still arrest for car carry and let a jury decide if someone met the traveling requirments. [/quot]

That statement is true and is understandable.

46.02 was modified because even after "traveling" was defined

I believe that 'traveling" still remains undefined. If you know otherwise please post a link or valid reference.

In any event, the current law clearly does not consider concealed carry while in your motor vehicle a violation, whether traveling or not.

PC 46.02. UNLAWFUL CARRYING WEAPONS. (a) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun, illegal knife, or club if the person is not:
> (1) ...
> (2) inside of or directly en route to a motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control.
(a-I) A person commits an offense if the person intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly carries on or about his or her person a handgun in a motor vehicle that is owned by the person or under the person's control at any time in which:
> (1) the handgun is in plain view;