IFF - Lessons from Blue on Blue Shooting Studies

[jester]

I agree. If the prosecutor is willing to lie to the jury, you're in trouble.

[Excaliber]

I agree. If the prosecutor is willing to lie to the jury, you're in trouble.

Remember that he wasn't at the scene to see what happened first hand. Consider that he may not lie at all at trial - he may simply not believe your version of what happened.

Having some truths and some falsehoods in your story has a tendency to encourage that.

[Purplehood]

Claiming you are a Police Officer when you are not can result in an arrest, jail time and felony too. Just freeze, if you already pulled your pistol then drop it to the ground and follow commands.

At the point you find yourself at the muzzle of police weapon, this is a trivial consideration, and not terribly likely anyway. Playing Barney Fife and pulling over people with your blue light, yeah, you are going to see some charges. Saving your own butt at the tail end of a SD shooting -- the first priority is NOT getting shot by the responding police officer. Everything else can take care of itself later.

Farnam (a police officer, btw) actually recommended this to us in a slightly different context. Out of the dozen police officers in his classes along with us citizens, he got no pushback and lots of agreement. Specifically, "POLICE DON"T SHOOT!" Police get snippy about it later, your lawyer can challenge them to prove you didn't say "PLEASE DON"T SHOOT." But again, you are alive to argue about it.

I fully agree with shouting "Police don't shoot!". I would rather be alive explaining why I said it, rather than any alternative.

[toddlinder]

Excaliber - well said, as usual. Certainly others may disagree, but it seems quite a risk.

[Bart]

You both make good points about prosecution.

Many muggers have a criminal record and are known to the police. If one of those muggers is shot by someone who has never been arrested, has a steady job, pays their taxes, etc. the DA knows the score. If the DA decides to persecute the crime victim, he knows what he's doing.

However, we have people with multiple misdemeanor convictions, or even felony (def.adj.) convictions, post here asking if they are eligible for a CHL. If they turned their lives around (or haven't been caught recently) they may be eligible. If they shoot a mugger who, however unlikely it may seem, doesn't have a criminal record yet, the situation may be unclear to the DA. He's looking at someone with priors (maybe for assault) who shot someone with no record. Introducing additional murkiness may not benefit the crime victim who defended himself.

[Hoi Polloi]

It was pointed out to me that the responding officer would most likely recognize that you, a layman, would say police like you'd say please: puh-LEASE. Many officers are trained to say PO-lease like pole to avoid confusing the words police and please.

If I had a uniformed police officer aiming at me and I thought he was about to shoot me, I wouldn't hesitate to address him directly and make a request: "Police! Don't shoot!" If I knew his name, I'd say, "Bob! Don't shoot!" but since all I'd know about him was that he was police, I'd get his attention the way I knew. If he asked why I said I was police, my lawyer would happily explain my reasoning and I can't imagine a DA taking up that case where the victim the LEO was about to shoot didn't get shot because she called out for help from the police.

[Purplehood]

It was pointed out to me that the responding officer would most likely recognize that you, a layman, would say police like you'd say please: puh-LEASE. Many officers are trained to say PO-lease like pole to avoid confusing the words police and please.

If I had a uniformed police officer aiming at me and I thought he was about to shoot me, I wouldn't hesitate to address him directly and make a request: "Police! Don't shoot!" If I knew his name, I'd say, "Bob! Don't shoot!" but since all I'd know about him was that he was police, I'd get his attention the way I knew. If he asked why I said I was police, my lawyer would happily explain my reasoning and I can't imagine a DA taking up that case where the victim the LEO was about to shoot didn't get shot because she called out for help from the police.

EXACTLY!

[VMI77]

If I had a uniformed police officer aiming at me and I thought he was about to shoot me, I wouldn't hesitate to address him directly and make a request: "Police! Don't shoot!" If I knew his name, I'd say, "Bob! Don't shoot!" but since all I'd know about him was that he was police, I'd get his attention the way I knew.

I don't think I'd go this way myself as I agree with Excabliber, but if you're going to go this way, it might be better to use the singular "officer" instead of the plural "police." It may also make a more credible defense. As in "Officer! ....don't shoot." or "Officer!.....please don't shoot."

[CompVest]

Ditto!

[jbirds1210]

Carry a wallet in your off hand pocket...hold it up high with your support hand if your safety mandates keeping someone at gun point until the police arrive. A wallet in your hand does not say I am a cop, but I have yet to see a crook hold his wallet in the air. It would cause me, as the arriving officer, to ask some questions before making any decisions.

Guns drawn is not the best time to tell your side of the story...I am all for not getting shot, and trust me...I would drop my gun like a hot potatoe if I was off duty and an arriving LEO told me to drop it.

Jason

[Paladin]

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