Yet another thread about dogs

nitrogen · Post by **nitrogen** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 10:27 am

Never ceases to amaze me how ignorant or selfish people can be.

I'm working on my new car on Saturday, installing my Satellite radio, when I hear barking approaching quickly. My car doors are closed, only my hood and trunk open. My back is against my car when I see three dogs approach. One looks like a rotweiler, one looks like a doberman, and one looks like some type of huskey. (I'm not much of a dog person)

So I stand absolutely still, not looking directly at the dogs, and the rotweiler starts growling and barking. Hand moving to pistol when a woman comes running after the dogs. "Sorry! THEY KEEP BREAKING THEIR LEASHES! Can you help me get them back home?"

"Lady, I ain't touching your dogs, one of 'ems growling at me!"
"Ohh, they are all such sweet dogs they won't hurt you."
"Please get them under control, and keep them under control.I don't want them here, or i'll call the police." (Rotweiler looking dog starts growling again) and I retreat into the house.

She gets her sons to round up the dogs. (This takes about 15 mins)

I am nervous around big dogs that growl at me. I was in "condition red" so to speak, ready to draw and shoot. Even though nothing ended up happening, I felt somewhat ill and shaky afterward.

Yet another reason I'm glad I carry every time I leave the house, and I'm even more glad that I didn't have to shoot someone's dog on Saturday.

Mithras61 · Post by **Mithras61** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 10:54 am

nitrogen wrote:"Sorry! THEY KEEP BREAKING THEIR LEASHES! Can you help me get them back home?"

It always amazes me that people say such stupid stuff. I would have thought three things were obvious before she even said a word here:

1) She needs stronger leashes
2) A stranger is NOT the right person to help her with her out-of-control dogs (especially one that the dogs have already threatened!)
3) She is not the leader of that pack. She OUGHT to be, but she isn't.

I have almost always had a dog in my house. My dogs stay near me when they are out with me. They do not need to be on a leash when we go on a walk (they are, but they don't NEED to be). If you can not keep your dogs under your control, you either should not have dogs or should not have them out of the house or their pen.

I'm sorry you had a bad experience Saturday. I hope you do not have to deal with this again, but from her comment, I'd say it would be wise to stay at "condition orange" (yes, I know - you shouldn't have to...) when outside your home until you are confident that she has either left the area or has gotten her dogs under control.

seamusTX · Post by **seamusTX** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:19 am

Our paper had a story last week about a big dog that "got loose" and attacked a smaller dog whose owner, an elderly woman, was walking it on a leash. It was the second time the big dog had attacked another dog, and the owner of the dog that had been attacked previously had a dog killed in similar circumstances.

I'm peeved that dog owners and other excuse this kind of behavior. I know dogs are "dumb animals," but they can be trained. Failing to do so is criminally irresponsible, IMHO.

Two words: pepper spray.

- Jim

txinvestigator · Post by **txinvestigator** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:58 am

The overwhelming majority of dog owners, IN MY OPINION, make huge mistakes when they treat their dogs like people and assign human type emotion to them.

Dogs are pack ANIMALS, and always rise to the level of dominance their pack allows. The people in the home are the dogs pack. There IS going to be a dominant figure, and there is going to be pack order.

People who allow their dogs on the furniture, in bed, and don't immediately correct assertive behavior will end up with trouble.

These are the dogs that cause others concern. There are way too many.

That rant made, there are some things to know about dogs that can help you in situations like above.

A dog intent on attacking is going to do so. A dog in that attack frenzy will charge and attack. A dog who growls, barks and is hesitant is testing the waters, so to speak. A dominant and assertive posture and actions can back such a dog off. Never turn your back on one, and never run. Assume a chest out, shoulders back and eyes set forward look. If you have an object you can hold between you and the dog, use it.

Most of the time the dog will move on.

However, if you get one of those attacking you protect your head, neck and groin. If unarmed try to gouge the eyes. Dogs in attack frenzy are unbelievably able to ignore pain, so drastic measures must be taken. if armed with OC, I would use that first simply due to the chance of missing the dog with a bullet and causing injury to others. If OC did not work, or I was without, I would not hesitate to shoot the dog.

Unfortunately, I don't see any solution thru the owners. Every dog owner believes "their" dog or situation is somehow special, and they justify raising their dog like people. And this comes from a dog owner. I have a 100 pound German Shepherd who is 4th in our pack. My daughter is a leader to him.

Nitrogen, I am glad your situation ended up well. Dogs in a pack are much more likely to attack than lone dogs. Have you considered notifying animal control?

Paladin · Post by **Paladin** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 11:59 am

I'm a dog person, but that situation would put me in condition red as well. Sounds like you handled it pretty well.

Years ago I had some neighbors that had a pit bull that kept breaking its collar. It took them a while to find one strong enough to hold the dog. Not a big problem for me, because our dogs loved each other... but I know other people had some issues with it.

The lady in your situation obviously can't control the dogs. Certainly she needs stronger leashes. But even with better leashes, I doubt she could control those 3 large dogs by herself. I have 2 powerful dogs, who behave themselves most of the time, but I prefer walking them separately or having some assistance.

As I recall, you had some concerns about using pepper spray with your asthma? So ruling pepper spray out, in the future you could try verbal commands on the dogs (i.e. NO, DOWN, GO HOME), or maybe some sort of club (i.e. MAGLITE, walking stick) if you're not ready to shoot.

Boma · Post by **Boma** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:41 pm

Do you think a .380 caliber bullet will stop a dog? Or at least scare it away?

seamusTX · Post by **seamusTX** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:52 pm

Boma wrote:Do you think a .380 caliber bullet will stop a dog? Or at least scare it away?

If you shoot a dog in the brain or lungs even with .22, it's most likely going to die. It might still bite you a few times before expiring.

I've read accounts of police officers who were attacked and bitten multiple times even after shooting the dog with their service piece.

As for the bang scaring the dog away, some will run and won't stop until they're in the next county. Others will ignore it. Two stray dogs were living at the Texas City range last year. They even went down range a couple of times when people were shooting.

While we're on the subject, last week a man in Houston was attacked by a large dog and choked it to death. That's the kind of thing you can achieve when you're motivated and creative. ("Police said the man wouldn't be charged." Duh.)

- Jim

Paladin · Post by **Paladin** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 1:56 pm

Boma wrote:Do you think a .380 caliber bullet will stop a dog? Or at least scare it away?

Nothing is guaranteed, but gunshots will scare some dogs, and statistically dogs die more often when inflicted with gunshot wounds than humans.

Show Killer · Post by **Show Killer** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:06 pm

Did the dog growling at you look something like this?

Click the link for a bigger/different picture.
http://www.showkiller.com/images/zeus1.jpg

That's my boy Zeus. I feel sorry for anyone that tries to break into the house. He's 9 months old and about 105# right now.

dpatterson · Post by **dpatterson** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:39 pm

Hey Show.... You might think about resizing that pic for the Dialup users...

If you need some help let me know.

Show Killer · Post by **Show Killer** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 2:53 pm

dpatterson wrote:Hey Show.... You might think about resizing that pic for the Dialup users...

If you need some help let me know.

I changed it to a smaller picture for the dial up crowd. I linked the original picture for the speed demons.

nitrogen · Post by **nitrogen** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 3:06 pm

Yeah, he looked like that, only larger and a bit more menacing.

While growing up, a friend of mine had a huge rotweiler named Bear. He was the sweetest dog, but very powerful. He was well trained, and knew not to jump up on you. If he did, he'd knock you on your posterior easily.

As stated above, I avoid irritants and inflammatory agents because of a reaction I had when I was younger when I got exposed to some pepper spray and Asthma that I have.

txinvestigator · Post by **txinvestigator** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 3:11 pm

Here is my warrior; carrying a brick around

With his girl;

Mithras61 · Post by **Mithras61** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 3:13 pm

nitrogen wrote:Yeah, he looked like that, only larger and a bit more menacing.

While growing up, a friend of mine had a huge rotweiler named Bear. He was the sweetest dog, but very powerful. He was well trained, and knew not to jump up on you. If he did, he'd knock you on your posterior easily.

As stated above, I avoid irritants and inflammatory agents because of a reaction I had when I was younger when I got exposed to some pepper spray and Asthma that I have.

I always liked this mace for use against dogs & other critters

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Maces.jpg

txinvestigator · Post by **txinvestigator** » Mon Feb 05, 2007 3:25 pm

Mithras61 wrote:
nitrogen wrote:Yeah, he looked like that, only larger and a bit more menacing.

While growing up, a friend of mine had a huge rotweiler named Bear. He was the sweetest dog, but very powerful. He was well trained, and knew not to jump up on you. If he did, he'd knock you on your posterior easily.

As stated above, I avoid irritants and inflammatory agents because of a reaction I had when I was younger when I got exposed to some pepper spray and Asthma that I have.
I always liked this mace for use against dogs & other critters

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Maces.jpg

Unfortunately that Mace is illegal to carry. lol