Carrying or transporting a gun on private plane

[Doug.38PR]

How can I legally do this. Someone is picking me up Thursday in a private plane at an airport to take me to Colorado. How can I legally carry or at least pack my handgun in my luggage?

[txflyer]

As a private pilot I know of no regulation permitting carry on board a private aircraft as long as the PIC (pilot in command) approves and the aircraft is operating under part 91. Best thing to do is ask the PIC. He is the one that can say yes/no. If the aircraft is operating under another part then the the answer may be controlled by regulations.

Basically FAR 91.3 makes the PIC a god with final say and responsibility for the flight.

Sec. 91.3 - Responsibility and authority of the pilot in command.

(a) The pilot in command of an aircraft is directly responsible for, and is the final authority as to, the operation of that aircraft.

(b) In an in-flight emergency requiring immediate action, the pilot in command may deviate from any rule of this part to the extent required to meet that emergency.

(c) Each pilot in command who deviates from a rule under paragraph (b) of this section shall, upon the request of the Administrator, send a written report of that deviation to the Administrator.

[Doug.38PR]

Does that apply carrying in luggage or carrying on person. I'd rather just pack the gun with the rset of my luggage.

[KaiserB]

Does that apply carrying in luggage or carrying on person. I'd rather just pack the gun with the rest of my luggage.

The PIC (Pilot in charge) is the ultimate authority on the plane. He can deny you boarding, luggage, or other articles. To add some clarity are you chartering the ride? Is it a shuttle ride (i.e. Hobby field to GB International)? Tourism ride (e.g. flying to the Grand Canyon sight seeing)? Or a private pilot friend taking you for a ride?

[Keith B]

IANAL, but if you do not have to go through the secured area of an airport here, and the pilot is OK with it, then should be legal.

You may want to check the Colorado laws on having a firearm concealed in the airport unsecured areas, but if nothing, then you should be OK there too.

[ErnieP]

Isn't the tarmac a secured area at an airport served by commercial aviation and/or with a foreign trade zone?? It would seem odd that carry would be permitted by anyone where access could be had to airport traffic at such an airport. I've heard other private pilots talk about carrying, which obviously doesn't become an issue until detected, but if detected, it would occur that the pilot may lose their license. Can anyone help with quotes to any Regs that permit/allow an exception to the general prohibition of weapons in secured areas?? Just need to be clear before I attempt this myself....tnx

[Keith B]

Isn't the tarmac a secured area at an airport served by commercial aviation and/or with a foreign trade zone?? It would seem odd that carry would be permitted by anyone where access could be had to airport traffic at such an airport. I've heard other private pilots talk about carrying, which obviously doesn't become an issue until detected, but if detected, it would occur that the pilot may lose their license. Can anyone help with quotes to any Regs that permit/allow an exception to the general prohibition of weapons in secured areas?? Just need to be clear before I attempt this myself....tnx

Unless you have to go through a security check point, then it is not considered a 'secured area.' Many small airports you don't have to go through a metal detector or security screening.

[AEA]

Yes....but what about the one you land at?

[texasag93]

Yes....but what about the one you land at?

Except when traveling internationally, I have never been checked or screened when I have landed at an airport.

I am interested in this thread as I am thinking about getting my private license some day.

texasag

[barres]

I have heard many pilots on gun boards talk about the GA (General Aviation) portion of airports being largely wide open in terms of security, and many of them talk of flying while armed. I would agree that if the PIC has no problem with it, and Colorado has no law against carrying in the unsecured portion of the airport, then you could CC the whole time. Locked in your luggage should also be perfectly fine, if you and the PIC would be more comfortable that way (you literally and him figuratively ).
[/I am not a pilot]

[KaiserB]

The pilot will probably be ok with you having the gun in checked luggage, or luggage under the pilots control. You will probably have to make prior arrangements of some sort to insure the air operator in this case will allow firearms on their planes.

You are Federally prohibited from carrying a firearm, concealed, cased, or within your control in almost every area of the AOA (Air Operations Area) as defined by 49 CFR 1540.5

Air operations area (AOA) means a portion of an airport, specified in the airport security program, in which security measures specified in this part are carried out. This area includes aircraft movement areas, aircraft parking areas, loading ramps, and safety areas, for use by aircraft regulated under 49 CFR part 1544 or 1546, and any adjacent areas (such as general aviation areas) that are not separated by adequate security systems, measures, or procedures. This area does not include the secured area.

Within the AOA firearms restrictions apply under 49 CFR 1540.111 This means your firearm should be put in a bag (which contains a locked case) which is checked (in this case handed to the pilot or other designated individual) prior to the entrance of the AOA (i.e. tarmac).

[ErnieP]

Thanks KaiserB for your references. Does anyone have AOPA's analysis on this topic??

[tomc]

Thanks KaiserB for your references. Does anyone have AOPA's analysis on this topic??

I have been following this thread with interest, since I am a pilot and fly while carrying all the time both as a pilot and a passenger in private aircraft (generally referred to as part 91 operations covering general operating rules) This does not include operations with commercial passenger and cargo operating rules which fall under their own rules.

I have looked over the TSA regs that KaiserB has referenced (title 49 - Transportation, chapter XII - Transportation Security Administration, parts subchapter C - Civil Aviation Security) and respectfully disagree with his interpretation of them with regarding CHL carry. The prohibitions stated in the regulations are limited to what is defined as the Sterile Area of the airport:

Sterile area means a portion of an airport defined in the airport security program that provides passengers access to boarding aircraft and to which the access generally is controlled by TSA, or by an aircraft operator under part 1544 of this chapter or a foreign air carrier under part 1546 of this chapter, through the screening of persons and property.

Note that part 1544 deals with commercial carriers and 1546 refers to cargo carriers. This is where you go through TSA screening and secure airplane boarding.

I have personlly flown into DFW airport, parked at the general aviation area, got on a shuttle bus to a main terminal to drop off a friend, returned to the general aviation area, got back into my plane and flew out. At no time did I have to go into a Sterile Area and was never screened. The only locked door I went through was back to my plane where I just asked an attendant that I needed to return to my plane.

Back in 2005, I believe, a bill was introduced in Texas that would include all areas of the airport as being prohibited, but it never made it out of committee. Mentioning AOPA, I recall they were in favor of the bill, so don’t go to them for advice or clarification on this issue.

You do have to be aware of where you are going if out of state, because some states restrict carry in non-sterile areas of the airport. I know Virginia is one and I think Indiana is another. I think that Colorado is like Texas regarding airports. Without having flown to Colorado before, it would probably be wise to lock up your firearm in a gun case and travel with it that way. You could always ask the pilot before you go and see what he says.

Keep in mind that this is not legal advise, nor am I charging anything for it (you get what you pay for).

[KBCraig]

You do have to be aware of where you are going if out of state, because some states restrict carry in non-sterile areas of the airport. I know Virginia is one and I think Indiana is another.

I don't know about Indiana, but Virginia, Arkansas, and Nevada outlaw all airport carry.

Edit to clarify: Those three states (and possibly others that I don't recall) outlaw all carry within the passenger terminal of airports, even outside the sterile area. This doesn't mean GA would be affected (but you would be wise to check for yourself before flying GA into those states).

[aardwolf]

I've heard other private pilots talk about carrying, which obviously doesn't become an issue until detected, but if detected, it would occur that the pilot may lose their license.

Why? What rule or regulation do you allege they violate?

As a passenger in Texas I found nothing prohibiting firearms on private planes or at airports as long as I stay outside the sterile area.