Snubbies: 5,6,7 rds; .38, .357, 9MM, 10MM, .45 ACP

[surprise_i'm_armed]

http://www.whichgun.com/firearms/revolvers

The above link is to a site that was recommended by someone else on the board in a previous thread,
and I find it quite useful for researching and comparing various handguns. It's where I did the basic research for
this thread.

Although my EDC is a semi-automatic, I really like shooting my wheelgun too, and feel that folks should have a mix
of semi-auto's and wheelguns. My truck BUG is fine for the truck, but I am toying with the idea of getting a snubbie
for an ONBODY BUG.

The most common form of snubby out there is a 5 shot, .38 Special, with a barrel = or < 2.00".
But of course more rounds would be better, right?
And wouldn't a choice of other calibers mix it up a little further?
So if you are considering getting a snubby, here are some other choices out there.

6 Rounds of .38 Special
Charter Arms Police Undercover
Taurus Model 856
Taurus Model 856 Magnesium

7 Rounds of .38 Special
Taurus Model 817 Ultra Lite

7 rounds of .357 Magnum
Taurus Model 617

The only 9MM snubby
Taurus Model 905. It holds only 5 rounds though.

The only 10MM snubby. I use the term loosely, since the barrel = 2.8".
Smith and Wesson Model 310 Night Guard. Capacity = 6 rounds.

The only .45 snubby - also with a 2.8" barrel, not a true < or = 2.0" barrel.
Smith and Wesson Model 325 Night Guard. Capacity = 6 rounds.

IIRC, someone stated that 9MM, 10MM, and .45 ACP might not be the best ammo for a revolver
caliber. Something to do with the rim and the ejector not working too well to empty them out?

IMHO, if I get a snubby, I'd be leaning towards the Taurus Model 817. Packing 7 rounds into a reliable
wheelgun that's in the same size/weight ballpark as many 5 rounders seems like a good deal to me.
I'm not real hep on a .357 since they kick like a mule.

Opinions on these options, forum friends?

SIA

[AdioSS]

I would get the 7 round .357 since you would have the option of loading with .38 or .357.

[Diesel42]

IMHO, snubbies are great at close range but my precision drops significantly beyond 10 yards. I can accurately fire a shot at 10 yards, I just can't hold a tight group. So, for me, a snubby is a fine choice up close. I've carried a Taurus 905 (9mm) in a cross draw holster when driving. It's a comfortable weaon and very low maintenance.
HTH
Nick

[The Annoyed Man]

Two other suggestions....

For an on-body BUG: The S&W M&P340 (because I own one and love it). This a standard 5 shot 1-7/8" barreled snubbie in .357 magnum, except that it has a Scandium frame and weighs a mere 13 oz empty. Yes, it does sting the hand with a full house self-defense load like the Hornady 125 grain Critical Defense ammo I keep in it, but it isn't that bad....certainly not bad enough to make aiming it or shooting it difficult. For my book, the hand stinging is a mild trade-off for the added known stopping power of the .357 magnum cartridge, and in an actual shooting situation, you're not going to notice it. The Hornady load still generates nearly 1200 fps and 400 ft lbs of energy at the muzzle in that snub nose barrel.

For an "in the glove box" BUG: The S&W 640 (because I own one and love it). This is an all stainless steel, 5 shot .357 magnum with a 2-1/8" barrel. Variations of this pistol can be found without the enclosed hammer, and with barrels of different lengths, but this particular model retains the virtue of being an enclosed hammer pocketable gun if called on for that role. However, being made of all stainless steel, it weighs quite a bit more than any of the alloy framed variants—23 oz—and that extra weight translates to much better recoil management. It also comes with a larger set of grips, aiding in control. With one other difference besides an extra 1/4" of barrel, it functions just like the above mentioned M&P340. That other difference is that it has a superior trigger. The M&P340's trigger is superior to the 642's (for the price difference, it better be), but it isn't as good as the 640's. Anyway, the 640 is a tough, rugged little beastie with lots of zoom—a "kit gun" if you will. (Also look at the Ruger SP101 for the same reasons.)

Other suggestions.....

Any compact or subcompact Glock, S&W M&P, or Kahr sem-auto of caliber 9mm or greater. These have revolver-like simplicity of operation, but with higher capacity than a revolver. Even a diminutive Kahr PM9/CM9/MK9 has 6+1 on tap with a 7 round backup magazine. Of the three, the Kahr has the most "revolver-like" trigger, with a long but butter smooth pull. Some models of both the M&P series and the Kahrs are available with an external thumb safety. On the M&P it isn't absolutely necessary as there is an articulated trigger safety mechanism which doesn't function like the Glock's, but produces the same results. On the Kahr it isn't absolutely necessary for the same reasons as it isn't necessary to have one on a revolver—that long trigger pull.

There are plenty of other guns in the S&W lineup that have similar characteristics to the M&P line of semi-autos. Taurus and Ruger both produce pistols that fit this general mold.

One of the things you may have noticed is that none of the guns I have mentioned are exactly cheap. Some are more reasonably priced than others. For instance, Glock prices are generally pretty reasonable, the reason being their sheer abundance, which is no reflection on their quality. Buy a cheap gun if that is all you can afford, but you must be perfectly honest about the word "afford." If you can afford more, spend more. I highly recommend wearing a motorcycle helmet too for motorcyclists, but if you going to go to the trouble of buying one, ask yourself "how much is my brain worth?" and get the best one you have enough money for. Self-defense pistols should be approached the same way. Your very LIFE may one day depend on the reliability and ruggedness of the gun you buy, and guns are generally like anything else....quality comes at a price. DON'T CHEAP OUT, unless that is all you can truly afford—even for a lowly "truck gun."

Another caveat for almost any truck gun, I highly recommend that they be kept stored in an inexpensive holster of some sort to protect the trigger from being accidentally accessed—especially if this gun is going to be sliding around on the floor under your seat—particularly for any semi-auto without an externally actuated safety switch. Better yet, devise some means of retention, so you can count on the pistol being exactly where you're going to reach for it if you really do need it. There have been a number of threads on this forum illustrating methods for doing exactly that, and there are a number of products already on the market designed for exactly for the purpose of gun retention with ready access in a vehicle.

Despite my long professed love of the 1911 platform, I have deliberately avoided mentioning it as a truck gun. I could make a joke and say that the 1911 is far too dignified to be found sliding around the floor on a pickup truck, but the reality of it is that ANY single action only semi-auto that was designed to be carried cocked and locked without a double action first shot capability is probably not a good idea in an environment where bouncing around unattended might result in the safety mechanisms being accidentally switched off. This is doubly so if the pistol is not contained in some kind of rudimentary holster which protects the trigger from access. I love my 1911s, but they are best carried on the body, or kept on the bed stand. Loose inside a vehicle is not the place for a 1911 pistol.

[CC Italian]

I think a good one that people always neglect is the .44 special. Heavy bullet, good sectional density and seems to have less recoil then the .357 mag IMO. I say this because I have only shot .44 special out of a .44 mag Redhawk and it is a heavy beast. It has a much lower velocity then the .357 but it has similar characteristics to the .38 special but obviously a heavier bullet and larger diameter.

[The Annoyed Man]

I think a good one that people always neglect is the .44 special. Heavy bullet, good sectional density and seems to have less recoil then the .357 mag IMO. I say this because I have only shot .44 special out of a .44 mag Redhawk and it is a heavy beast. It has a much lower velocity then the .357 but it has similar characteristics to the .38 special but obviously a heavier bullet and larger diameter.

Properly loaded, the .44 Special's ballistics can be very similar to the .45 ACP....and you're right, it is a very much overlooked cartridge for self-defense. There are only two reasons I don't use it in my Model 29. One is that it's a big beast, weighing in at 48 oz unloaded. That's not really a concealable package. The other reason is that .44 magnum is so much more fun to shoot. A friend of mine and I were shooting it at DPC the other day, and in broad daylight it shot a bright orange fireball THIS big out the muzzle. It made us giggle like giddy school girls. No .44 special will do that for you.

But certainly a large framed revolver chambered in either .44 Special or .45 ACP would make a very good truck gun.

[karder]

To add to what Andy said, there is some advantage to packing a truck gun in the same caliber that matches your normal carry gun. If you normally carry .45, .40, or 9mm, having a truck gun in the same caliber using moon clips could be an advantage. I would rather enjoy a revolver in .45 acp to complement my Colt and Kimber when I am carrying those.

[surprise_i'm_armed]

Andy C - A picture is worth a thousand words. I hadn't seen moon clips before.

TAM - My truck revolver is in a seatbelt holster and is oriented with the grip up, the business end of the barrel
down. It is firmly secured, the trigger is covered, and it never moves out of drawing position. There is no sliding
around, so my hand always falls naturally to drawing position.
Those ammo stats on the .357 are pretty impressive. My revolver is loaded with .38 Special since if it's ever
used from my driver's seat, the .38's have less recoil and noise. Although I stated in the OP that I'd go with a .38 in a 2" snubby,
I'd consider going with the .357 in an onbody BUG since if it's in my pocket or on my belt, I'd be able to fire it outside.
A .357 does make an impressive audio statement, and the body penetration stats are pretty good too. :-)

*******************************************************************************************
IMHO, if any forum members regularly carry an EDC and a BUG onbody, I wonder whether most would go with one
semi-auto + a revolver, or if 2 semi-auto's might be the norm.

Some forum contributor, I can't remember who, said that he carries 2 revolvers. One in .357, one in .38, and the ability
to reload each. Two revolvers onbody would seem to be a more unique (EDC + BUG) combo.

What is anyone's opinions on Charter Arms revolvers? Are they cheap and good, or cheap and low quality?
FYI - For anyone who wants a revolver with color, they have gold, pink, maybe others.
A lady that wants a pink gun could consider one of those. IIRC, Taurus has some pink guns also.

SIA

[Excaliber]

Andy C - A picture is worth a thousand words. I hadn't seen moon clips before.

TAM - My truck revolver is in a seatbelt holster and is oriented with the grip up, the business end of the barrel
down. It is firmly secured, the trigger is covered, and it never moves out of drawing position. There is no sliding
around, so my hand always falls naturally to drawing position.
Those ammo stats on the .357 are pretty impressive. My revolver is loaded with .38 Special since if it's ever
used from my driver's seat, the .38's have less recoil and noise. Although I stated in the OP that I'd go with a .38 in a 2" snubby,
I'd consider going with the .357 in an onbody BUG since if it's in my pocket or on my belt, I'd be able to fire it outside.
A .357 does make an impressive audio statement, and the body penetration stats are pretty good too. :-)

*******************************************************************************************
IMHO, if any forum members regularly carry an EDC and a BUG onbody, I wonder whether most would go with one
semi-auto + a revolver, or if 2 semi-auto's might be the norm.

Some forum contributor, I can't remember who, said that he carries 2 revolvers. One in .357, one in .38, and the ability
to reload each. Two revolvers onbody would seem to be a more unique (EDC + BUG) combo.

What is anyone's opinions on Charter Arms revolvers? Are they cheap and good, or cheap and low quality?

SIA

That was the police standard for many years - it was called the "New York Reload" because NYC officers weren't allowed to carry semiautos during that period and they often found themselves in situations that needed more than just 6 quick shots.

[CCreyeder]

I just picked up a new Ruger LCR in 357 the other day in a trade. Took it to the country for some shooting over the weekend and plan on doing a review after I have shot it a few more times. My initial thoughts are it is very light weight, I like the concealed hammer (original thinking that it would funtion in the role of on-body BUG and/or truck gun. ) Trigger pull is... ahh.. "stout" lol.. I shot both 38 and 357. The 357 will def punch you in the hand, but not so much you couldnt get through its 5 shot cylinder if you had to in an emergency. Yeah, accuracy sucks beyond 10 yrds or so, but I always figured snubbies were for up close and personal anyway.

I hadnt seen a 7 shot snubbie.. I will have to check out the one you mention.

ALso, regarding moon clips... I like that idea... however, doesnt the cylinder face have to be milled to accept those, or can you use them "off the shelve"?

[MoJo]

I'm not sure they are in stores yet, Taurus has two new snub noses the 405 (.40 S&W) and the 445 (.44 special) Both are available in blue and stainless the 405 uses moon clips the 445 is a standard revolver. Both are 5 shot.

[SQLGeek]

Other suggestions.....

Any compact or subcompact Glock, S&W M&P, or Kahr sem-auto of caliber 9mm or greater. These have revolver-like simplicity of operation, but with higher capacity than a revolver. Even a diminutive Kahr PM9/CM9/MK9 has 6+1 on tap with a 7 round backup magazine. Of the three, the Kahr has the most "revolver-like" trigger, with a long but butter smooth pull. Some models of both the M&P series and the Kahrs are available with an external thumb safety. On the M&P it isn't absolutely necessary as there is an articulated trigger safety mechanism which doesn't function like the Glock's, but produces the same results. On the Kahr it isn't absolutely necessary for the same reasons as it isn't necessary to have one on a revolver—that long trigger pull.

Another to look at that is at a lower price point is the Ruger LC9. It is a newer introduction this year so you may want to hold off until they've had more time to work out the kinks but it could be a viable BUG as well.

[snorri]

IMHO, if I get a snubby, I'd be leaning towards the Taurus Model 817. Packing 7 rounds into a reliable
wheelgun that's in the same size/weight ballpark as many 5 rounders seems like a good deal to me.
I'm not real hep on a .357 since they kick like a mule.

Opinions on these options, forum friends?

They made the J-frame five shots for a reason. It would have been easy to cut down a six shot revolver, but that wouldn't have been as compact. Going to seven rounds makes the cylinder even larger, assuming the same metallurgy and margin of safety.

With modern materials, I think a seven shot .38/.357 revolver is a good idea. I just don't think it's a great choice for pocket carry.