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Stupid · Post by **Stupid** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 9:49 pm

Thinking about getting a FFL myself, which allows me to get dealer's discount. In a short period of time, the cost would be recovered. I don't plan to do large amount of transfer for other people, mostly just for myself.

Question is, can I apply for a FFL even though I live in an apartment?

age_ranger · Post by **age_ranger** » Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:59 pm

From what I've heard, getting one primarily for personal use isn't much of a cost savings. There's FFL's that will do $5 transfers in DFW. Not sure where you're located, just have to find a good one.

I've thought of getting one too. Anyone have details on how to go about it and what the costs involved are?

Stupid · Post by **Stupid** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 12:25 am

You can get almost everything in dealer's cost.

Simple term, $200 application, good for 3 years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Firearms_License
http://www.nraila.org/Issues/FactSheets/Read.aspx?ID=70

age_ranger · Post by **age_ranger** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 7:48 am

Found the application on the ATF site. Went ahead and had one sent to me. Why not? Gonna look at it and see...........if anything, it might become a little hobby. Who knows.

jdowdle · Post by **jdowdle** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 8:13 am

I just got my FFL and first it will be almost impossible to get it if you live in an apartment. Doing it out of your house is a challenge. It isn't the ATF that prevents it for the most part but local ordinances. Most people get stopped by their home owners associations or city ordinances that govern what business can be done out of your home. This all depends on where you live though.

I don't think the ATF will approve one for an apartment resident since you don't control entry into the residence.

Also, to get an FFL you have to be doing it for a profit and not for personal use. If you sneak through the first time, it is unlikely it will get renewed because they want to see you doing an actual business.

Sorry for all the bad news.

Mithras61 · Post by **Mithras61** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 8:57 am

jdowdle wrote:I just got my FFL and first it will be almost impossible to get it if you live in an apartment. Doing it out of your house is a challenge. It isn't the ATF that prevents it for the most part but local ordinances. Most people get stopped by their home owners associations or city ordinances that govern what business can be done out of your home. This all depends on where you live though.

I don't think the ATF will approve one for an apartment resident since you don't control entry into the residence.

Also, to get an FFL you have to be doing it for a profit and not for personal use. If you sneak through the first time, it is unlikely it will get renewed because they want to see you doing an actual business.

Sorry for all the bad news.

I think he can get a C&R FFL...

The definition from Wikipedia:

A special type of FFL is available to individual collectors of curio or relic (C&R) firearms. C&R firearms are defined in Title 27, Code of Federal Regulations, Part 478.11[1] as those "which are of special interest to collectors by reason of some quality other than is associated with firearms intended for sporting use or as offensive or defensive weapons."

I don't know that it will do what he wants (e.g. - let him recoup the cost of licensing through destination & handling charges), but I think the license is available. For the recouping of costs, he may need a full dealer's FFL license, and if that is the case, an apartment may not be adequate.

txinvestigator · Post by **txinvestigator** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:46 am

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#c1

charlie · Post by **charlie** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:50 am

I had one for many years but dropped it . Bear in mind that if you declare your home as the business location, the ATF can show up anytime and demand to see your records and inspect your house and contents. They don't need a warrent because by getting a license you need to agree to the terms and comditions of the license. These T&Cs permit them entry anytime.

Some folks feel that this is intrusive.

Also, when I gave it up it was during the Clinton administration. The Govt was trying to eliminate the guys working out of their garages in order to "reduce the number of guns on the street". This was part of the Clinton anti-gun fervor.

Another reason had to do with the big gun sellers.
There was pressure put on politicians by lobbyists for the big box stores and big gun stores to get the small guys out of the picture so they wouldn't undercut the big stores. They were able to cut the small guys out under the guise of "responsible gun control". They accomplished this by more inspections, higher fees and making the whole business generally less attractive for the hobbyist.

Mr records were inspected by the ATF. They graciously called ahead of time and scheduled an appointment. They were professional, polite and well mannered. I have heard some horror stories, but my experience was positive. My records were in good order so I'm sure that helped.

You also have to have a Texas state tax permit and file the tax returns periodically.

After thinking about it I decided that with the changes during the Clinton adm, it was all too much of a hassel for the volume that I moved.

Roger Howard · Post by **Roger Howard** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 12:38 pm

I also checked into getting my FFL and I found that unless you buy firearms in bulk ($15,000) the discount just isn't that low. I found firearms cheaper in shows and in the auctions. I personally decided against even trying. I have the packet if I ever change my mind.

If you do try and get it you will need a security system and a good safe to even be considered. I would think living in an APT would also knock you out of the running.

casselthief · Post by **casselthief** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 12:42 pm

HEY! I take offense to that (not really, but it sounds good).
I live in an Apt, and lemme tell ya, it's secure! ('cept for the maintenance guy...)

I have a gunsafe, and two guard-cats!

srsly, you can double lock your doors, and/or do things to keep people out.
however, most Apt Complexes won't let you run a business from there unless you check it out with them.

that, and they hate aquariums....

Stupid · Post by **Stupid** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 7:22 pm

I guess I'd better drop this stupid idea till i really decide to do some business in firmarms.

Thank you so much for answering my question!!!

Mike1951 · Post by **Mike1951** » Wed Jan 10, 2007 9:47 pm

A C&R will get you the dealer discount from MidwayUSA and I think Brownells. Also Numrich and others. It's a lot easier to recover $30 than $200.

And there shouldn't be any issue with living in an apartment.

barres · Post by **barres** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 9:44 am

Would a C&R FFL allow you to have firearms shipped directly to you, even if that particular firearm didn't fall into the C&R category? Would a C&R FFL allow you to ship handguns through the USPS?

AG-EE · Post by **AG-EE** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 10:34 am

Would a C&R FFL allow you to have firearms shipped directly to you, even if that particular firearm didn't fall into the C&R category?

No, that is the exact reason for the C&R distinction. You can have C&R's only. Otherwise, go through an 01 FFL the same as you do now.

j1132s · Post by **j1132s** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 11:36 am

I thought about applying for an FFL a year ago. I have the packet sent by the ATF if anyone's interested, I can scan it and post. It is a 2 page application similar to the CHL application with the additional info on business hours, etc. This same aplication is used for (if I remember correctly) all different types of licenses, you just mark a check box. A copy needs to be mailed to your local police chief but there's doesn't seem a need for his/her approval.

At that time I wasn't sure if I'll be staying at the same location for too much longer, so decided to put it off until I moved. But , thanks to this thread, I'm reminded of the application and may fill it out. (Probably I'll call ATF again to get the latest and best application to be safe.)