Ellington Field Joint Reserve Base and Concealed Carry

[gregthehand]

Recently all Air and National Guard units were issued a memo stating that carry on guard property was authorized and were even issued guidelines on when and where they can carry, as well as the units responsibilities for dealing with concealed carry. I was in the National Guard years ago and my wife continues to serve in the Air National Guard at Ellington Field JRB. In the past we've always made it a point to make sure she had her backup pistol out of her vehicle and that she didn't forget to take her Ruger LCP out of her carry purse before going to drill. When I saw this memo come across I was relieved that was no longer going to be an issue. Or so I thought.

First off I want to say that I'm not worried about my wife's safety while at Ellington. I've gotten to know some of the Air Force Security Forces (SF) guys and they are locked on and squared away. It's a large reserve base as reserve bases go, but it's a small base overall. It's also very secure and besides the armed Air Force SF airmen there is also a an "Ellington Field Police Department/Security" that are TCOLE certified peace officers. It's travel to and from Ellington that worries me.

Anyway, at my wife's drill last weekend her unit received a yearly briefing from their JAG officer and in it she was told that due to Ellington being a federal installation, concealed carry was not allowed. This struck me as odd. The reason being is that a year before my wife got pulled over by those sharp SF guys I spoke about before for rolling through a stop sign. She was given a notice and not a ticket and on it she was told she had to notify her commander. She did so and he said that because Ellington was not federal property the Air Force SF guys could not issue tickets, they're not in their jurisdiction. However if she received three moving violations in a year she would not be allowed to drive on Ellington's JRB area and she'd have to park outside the gate and either walk in or have someone meet her at the gate and drive her to the unit's office. So how can they claim it's a federal area, and therefore carry is not allowed, yet the Air Force SF guys have no jurisdiction because it's not federal property?

Furthermore as I said earlier Ellington Field JRB actually employees state certified peace officers to patrol and enforce law on the premises. If it's federal property why do state certified LEOs have to be used to enforce law and make arrests? My understanding is that if someone needs to be arrested the Air Force SF guys can detain them and then the employed state guys will show up and make an arrest. In fact I've noticed now that while patrolling the area there is at least one of the Ellington Field JRB peace officers riding with the Air Force SF guys.

All this made me highly questionable as to whether or not the JAG did much homework past reading the memorandum form the state and deciding in their mind that Ellington Field JRB was off limits. Having served myself for a number of years I saw decisions like that made all the time so it wouldn't surprise me. The only thing that seems to give it any teeth is that in the memo from the state it said that carry was not allowed in areas controlled by reserve units as they are federal and not state. The Navy reserve, USMC reserve, active Coast Guard, and NASA all have facilities there with everyone but NASA having facilities within the secure area of the JRB. I'm not sure if their being within the secure area makes the entire area off limits, or just their buildings.

I'm mainly wondering if anyone else has any information about Ellington Field and specifically the JRB side? I seem to remember reading on here before that it was owned by the City of Houston and leased back to the occupants but I could be wrong. I was also wondering if someone knew a contact number for someone like the Texas Attorney General, or other governing office that could clarify this issue? I don't really know who to call and I don't want to just start an argument with the powers that be at Ellington as my wife plans on making a second career out of the guard and if we can she may even try to go active guard at Ellington one day if we can afford to do so (she makes a lot right now in her civilian job so it would be a big pay cut to go active guard).

Any input is appreciated!

[ELB]

Maybe address your question to the Office of the Adjutant General? The Adjutant General is the one who issued the order about carrying, IIRC, and he/his office should have a pretty good grip on which are state military properties and which are not.

https://tmd.texas.gov/office-of-the-adjutant-general

[JP171]

The JRB is leased to the Fed and carry is disallowed on the JRB. Anywhere else on Ellington as it is owned by the City you can carry with the exception of the coastie parking lot that is open to the public, you may NOT carry inside the fence as that is considered an FAA regulated area with the exception of having an aircraft there and then may carry. Your wife is allowed to have her personal weapon in the trunk IRC even on the JRB.

[jmorris]

According to the great god Wiki the field is owned by Houston and the military is a tenant. Unless they specifically lease the land, only the buildings themselves are considered federal, and then only in specific ways.

Up until I retired (thirteen days ago, yah!) I worked in a facility outside the Lackland AFB fence leased by the Air Force/Lackland AFB . That was a very different animal. When we moved into the building in 2010 there was a question about firearms and we were told no firearms inside the gate period and that Lackland (now JBSA) policy ruled. After that there was quite a few people parking just outside the gate and walking in. Then in 2013 somebody finally got around to querying the Lackland JA office and there response was that firearms were legal in the parking lot. Although the gates were manned by Security Forces, both SP and FP, the facility itself, parking lot and building, fell under Texas jurisdiction except for specifically federal laws. JBSA policy didn't apply If someone's purse was stolen in the building the San Antonio Police Department would respond, if someone saw you with a firearm in the building then SF would respond under 18/930.

Then there's the air strip, the old Kelly AFB field. The field is divided between Air National Guard and civilian, each on their own side of the strip. Each side is considered purely one or the other (Although the ANG is on Lackland). The ANG side of the field has specific military signs on the fence while the civilian side doesn't. Entry into at least one hanger on the civilian side has 30.06 posted.

So if the ANG is a tenant of Ellington Airport, especially separate from any AF tenancy, it seems Texas would have jurisdiction. If the buildings are on property leased by the AF and provided/subleased to the ANG then it would seem AF rules would apply. If the base is fenced as a whole but property is separately leased then it would seem the SF would only have jurisdiction in the AF portions.

You've got quite a can of worms there. I think I'd send inquires to the airport authority asking about the scope of the tenancy, the Reserve JA office asking about jurisdiction of the Security Forces, and one to the AG, as ELB suggested. I'm assuming the ANG has a very small JA office so querying them again would probably get the same answer, although it might provoke a deeper look.

[JP171]

JM, the entire old Ellington AFB is now the property of the city of Houston, the us government leases the property for the Joint Reserve Base, this portion falls under the Federal Provision and you cannot carry there hence the name Joint Reserve Base same as you cannot carry a weapon on Lackland nor of Ft Sam. the further tenancy of Texas National and Air Guard is under federal rules because of the lease and occupation by Reserve units. inside the fence the SP's can arrest and issue tickets but don't do so, its easier to just let HPD or Airport police deal with it. There are also the typical US Military Installation signs on the fence and at the entrance that has a guard 24/7

[jmorris]

That's what I was aiming at, how it was leased. When Brooks AFB was turned over to San Antonio, even though the AF leased every building on Brooks, they did not lease the property so outside of the buildings the SPs had no authority, command policy did not apply, etc. Couldn't even designate reserveed parking spots without adding them to the lease.i

[gregthehand]

JM, the entire old Ellington AFB is now the property of the city of Houston, the us government leases the property for the Joint Reserve Base, this portion falls under the Federal Provision and you cannot carry there hence the name Joint Reserve Base same as you cannot carry a weapon on Lackland nor of Ft Sam. the further tenancy of Texas National and Air Guard is under federal rules because of the lease and occupation by Reserve units. inside the fence the SP's can arrest and issue tickets but don't do so, its easier to just let HPD or Airport police deal with it. There are also the typical US Military Installation signs on the fence and at the entrance that has a guard 24/7

If that's the case why is the 147th, a guard unit, the host unit and therefore performs all maintenance on the base including the reserve buildings?

[JP171]

JM, the entire old Ellington AFB is now the property of the city of Houston, the us government leases the property for the Joint Reserve Base, this portion falls under the Federal Provision and you cannot carry there hence the name Joint Reserve Base same as you cannot carry a weapon on Lackland nor of Ft Sam. the further tenancy of Texas National and Air Guard is under federal rules because of the lease and occupation by Reserve units. inside the fence the SP's can arrest and issue tickets but don't do so, its easier to just let HPD or Airport police deal with it. There are also the typical US Military Installation signs on the fence and at the entrance that has a guard 24/7

If that's the case why is the 147th, a guard unit, the host unit and therefore performs all maintenance on the base including the reserve buildings?

hmmm let me see, because they get paid to do it......and BTW they don't do all the maintenance outside contractors do a lot in there