Guns on Campus

[endigo]

Here is a link to an interesting and heated discussion about Guns on campus.
http://www.dvorak.org/blog/?p=13280

Some college students are pushing for their schools to allow them to carry guns on campus.

They say they should have the right to protect themselves in the event of a shooting like the one that left 33 people dead at Virginia Tech.

Andrew Dysart, a George Mason University senior, has organized a chapter of Students for Concealed Carry on Campus.

The group hopes to convince legislators to overturn a Virginia law that allows universities to prohibit students, faculty and staff members with gun permits from carrying their weapons on campus.

Dysart says that the students at Tech should have had a chance to defend themselves.

Virginia law allows schools to decide whether to allow students with concealed-weapons permits to carry their guns on campus.

One state school, Blue Ridge Community College, does allow it. Schools cannot prohibit non-students or other outsiders from carrying weapons onto campuses if they have legal permits.

[WarHawk-AVG]

So are we asking for 100% legal carry all the time

Such as students/teachers/faculty all have the 100% ability to carry anywhere on campus at any time?

I really don't know exactly how I feel about it

[LedJedi]

everyone who is mentally and physically able and ready to carry allowed to carry all the time, anywhere.

"shall not be infringed"

Simple, to the point.

[HEMIzygote]

everyone who is mentally and physically able and ready to carry allowed to carry all the time, anywhere.

"shall not be infringed"

Simple, to the point.

Exactly.

How many Virginia Tech students do you think had guns on them today on the first day of classes?

[Venus Pax]

If you can carry other places, you should be able to carry on a campus.

Honestly, I think people in the 18-21 category should have the option to apply for a permit. Many in this group are targets of crime. They are also considered adults by legal standards. Are they less deserving of their rights?

[Will938]

I carried on campus today, but I wasn't going into any buildings

I really don't get the big deal, what's the difference between me sitting in a room with 300 people hearing a lecture or me sitting in a theater with 300 people watching a movie? One of them is perfectly acceptable and the other one raises all sorts of fears.

[TexAg08]

Where did you carry on campus Will? Ill probably make a trip to campus this week just to walk around and look at all the new freshman scenery . However, Ive heard some conflicting facts on concealed carry on A&M campus, my CHL instructor and local cop I know said its fine, but Ive also read that A&M's rules trump Texas Law in this instance, so someone please inform me.

[KBCraig]

Ive also read that A&M's rules trump Texas Law

Rules apply to students, faculty, and employees. Visitors are free to laugh at the rules, so long as they stay out of the statutorily-defined "premises".

[KBCraig]

everyone who is mentally and physically able and ready to carry allowed to carry all the time, anywhere.

Or as L. Neil Smith put it so eloquently:

Every man, woman, and responsible child has an unalienable individual, civil, Constitutional, and human right to obtain, own, and carry, openly or concealed, any weapon -- rifle, shotgun, handgun, machinegun, anything -- any time, any place, without asking anyone's permission.


He continues:

Someday to demonstrate that principle -- before I'm lying on my deathbed in a hospital with green plastic tubes up my nose, before arthritis sets in and I have to do it on crutches -- I intend to walk the length of Manhattan Island with a handgun openly on my hip, unmolested by any freelance or official parasite.

The question is, how do I get there from here?

Read the whole thing.

[frankie_the_yankee]

Or as L. Neil Smith put it so eloquently:

Every man, woman, and responsible child has an unalienable individual, civil, Constitutional, and human right to obtain, own, and carry, openly or concealed, any weapon -- rifle, shotgun, handgun, machinegun, anything -- any time, any place, without asking anyone's permission.

Idealism has its attractions doesn't it?

But I will guarantee you that almost no one, including you and even including Mr. Smith himself, would want to live in that world if they actually thought it through.

In real life, between organized gangs of criminals and jihadists, life would be one big 24/7 shootout - or "bombout" (take your pick).

He continues:

Someday to demonstrate that principle -- before I'm lying on my deathbed in a hospital with green plastic tubes up my nose, before arthritis sets in and I have to do it on crutches -- I intend to walk the length of Manhattan Island with a handgun openly on my hip, unmolested by any freelance or official parasite.

The question is, how do I get there from here?

Become a member of NYPD.

Otherwise, he could go stark raving mad, and do it in his dreams.

Sorry, but that's just the way it is.

I'd be happy if we could just do away with gun free zones, with exceptions for sterile areas like airplanes, etc.

[stevie_d_64]

I carried on campus today, but I wasn't going into any buildings

I really don't get the big deal, what's the difference between me sitting in a room with 300 people hearing a lecture or me sitting in a theater with 300 people watching a movie? One of them is perfectly acceptable and the other one raises all sorts of fears.

You're thinking logically...Like a true Aggie!

The ones that believe the opposite, and think emotionally...Are the ones that believe lightning couldn't strike twice...

WAIT! Let me clarify...

Maybe not in the same place, but it will strike somewhere else...It is a scientific and statistical fact!

The hope of the gun-control crowd is that they hope the logical thinkers outrage at the policy, it's obvious solution and call for action will die down, become less and less of a factor in any change to any rediculous policies some institutions inact...They actually stop their public diatribe as much as possible, and directly address the policy makers of institutions like this in private meetings and coorespondense (thats what I would do if I were them) telling them to be patient, study the situation, read the list of the deceased everyday, until they decide to keep the policies that allowed this to happen to stand...Thats how I'd play it...

Otherwise you'd have already had a public announcement of a change in policy to counter the threat from then on out, by not restricting the right of every person on that campus to CHOOSE, if they feel compelled to do so, to do what they can to take care of themselves...

I wouldn't say anything else about your carry habits, thats just my recommendation...

[Photoman]

I really don't get the big deal, what's the difference between me sitting in a room with 300 people hearing a lecture or me sitting in a theater with 300 people watching a movie? One of them is perfectly acceptable and the other one raises all sorts of fears.

That is a wonderful question! I think it is an example of the psychopathology of the people that irrationally fear guns. Unfortunately, they have way too much influence on the decisionmakers in our society.

I'm beginning to think the true pathology is within us for tolerating such silliness.

[KBCraig]

Or as L. Neil Smith put it so eloquently:

Every man, woman, and responsible child has an unalienable individual, civil, Constitutional, and human right to obtain, own, and carry, openly or concealed, any weapon -- rifle, shotgun, handgun, machinegun, anything -- any time, any place, without asking anyone's permission.

Idealism has its attractions doesn't it?

Yes it does. It is how we orient our moral compass, to establish what we believe is right and what is wrong; what is ideal.

But I will guarantee you that almost no one, including you and even including Mr. Smith himself, would want to live in that world if they actually thought it through.

And you would be wrong. Many of us have put a great deal of thought into it.

In real life, between organized gangs of criminals and jihadists, life would be one big 24/7 shootout - or "bombout" (take your pick).

Don't conflate anarchy with "thugocracy". In America, government causes more violence than it prevents.

[WarHawk-AVG]

Don't conflate anarchy with "thugocracy". In America, government causes more violence than it prevents.

And thats a proven FACT

[frankie_the_yankee]

But I will guarantee you that almost no one, including you and even including Mr. Smith himself, would want to live in that world if they actually thought it through.

And you would be wrong. Many of us have put a great deal of thought into it.

Not enough from where I sit.

In real life, between organized gangs of criminals and jihadists, life would be one big 24/7 shootout - or "bombout" (take your pick).

Don't conflate anarchy with "thugocracy".

I'm not conflating anything.

Most of us prefer some amount of government to anarchy.

Under anarchy, it has been written that life tends to be nasty, brutish, and short. I agree. And that's not the kind of life I aspire to, no matter how much "freedom" I could experience.

The Founders set up a GOVERNMENT, not an anarchy.

The Constitution is the foundation of our GOVERNMENT, not of our anarchy.

In America, government causes more violence than it prevents.

Oh, I don't think so.