In Border States, BATFE Asks: "May We See Your Guns?"

[Rockrz]

Looks that way, from what they said here...

Does that mean there's a mole in the NRA?
(like, do we need to call in Jack Bauer on this deal...?)

Do you have to register your NRA membership after a 3 day waiting period?
Seems like NRA membership records would be confidential.

What does BATF stand for?
I thought it was ATF

[LarryH]

bureau

[USA1]

bullies

[Bob Landry]

Come back when you have a warrant. or if you like, you can just sit on the front porch and scratch your butt and do whatever the mental midgets with badges do when it just doesn't go their way and I'm waiting for my attorney. Government isn't really famous for hiring the brightest or the best anyway.. This incident doesn't appear to be an exception to the rule..

[CompVest]

Please, keep in mind that this thread is not a rant against BATF it is about some action they have taken.
Thank you

[Rockrz]

Government isn't really famous for hiring the brightest or the best anyway...

What if they are the best and the brightest and thier superiors are giving them direct orders
to go on these "fishing trips"...should these officers disobey direct orders and risk getting
fired, resulting in them not being able to provide for their families?

I always wondered about that...what if we had a situation like Germany did back in
the late 30s, early 40s....you know, most of those guys were just "following orders"

Reckon our present day law enforcement agencies would follow orders from "Hitler"???
That'd be an interesting question.

[dicion]

I call Godwin's Law.

That ends the thread

I think everyone here has stated that they will either deny access without a warrant, or cooperate to prevent escalation of the situation.
What each individual person does is up to them, and everyone here understands both viewpoints. One is to protect a right, the other is to prevent more problems.

From what I can see The BATFE is not technically doing anything 'black and white' illegal by showing up and asking.
Is it possible 'discrimination against gun owners' or something? Maybe, that would be for a court to decide.
It would be illegal if they forced themselves in without a warrant, after being denied.
Do any of us agree with it? Most likely no. Should it be stopped? most of us would say yes.

[Rockrz]

I hear ya...I'd tell them no too.

Just like the time I got pulled over in this little bohunk town
for my license plate light not working...and I got out to look
for myself and it was working just fine, and the guy wrote
me a warning.

Then, asked me if he could look through my truck and
I told him no, "not without probable cause" (exact quote)
and he said "I know, but would it be OK if I looked anyway?"

And, again, I told him "No, not without probable cause"
and I calmly put it in drive and slowly began to drive off.

Both him and his buddy just stood there and didn't
chase me or anything so I guess they figured that
they did have anything on me.

Course, I do have long hair (about half way down
my back) so they probably thought I was either
on dope or peddlin it...but they're about 20 years
too late to catch me on that rap...

So, I guess I can see why those coppers were
wanting to look through my truck. I didn't
hold it against them, I just politely said NO

[Liberty]

Please, keep in mind that this thread is not a rant against BATF it is about some action they have taken.
Thank you

Maybe I don't understand and I am confused, but if the topic and the action we are discussing isn't worthy of rants and raving, I don't know what is. The topic is about a politically motivated investigation and attempts to entrap gun owners. It seems that rants about the abusive bureaucracy would be on topic and appropriate. In fact I can't think of an otherwise appropriate response from a RKBA community.

[Liberty]

bureau

I guesss that makes the employees Bureaucrats?

[boomerang]

I guesss that makes the employees Bureaucrats?

Correct. Just like the FBI.

[Rockrz]

The topic is about a politically motivated investigation and attempts to entrap gun owners

That brings up what I mentioned before about the rank and file "just following orders" that are given from above.

Makes one wonder how far rank and file law enforcement officers would go until they rebel against orders
from above when those orders go wrong....such as harrassing law abiding citizens over their Constitutional
right to keep and bear arms.

If the orders being handed down are crazy enough, do you think very many LEOs would rebel and not follow orders?

[03Lightningrocks]

Please, keep in mind that this thread is not a rant against BATF it is about some action they have taken.
Thank you

Maybe I don't understand and I am confused, but if the topic and the action we are discussing isn't worthy of rants and raving, I don't know what is. The topic is about a politically motivated investigation and attempts to entrap gun owners. It seems that rants about the abusive bureaucracy would be on topic and appropriate. In fact I can't think of an otherwise appropriate response from a RKBA community.

[CompVest]

I didn't have any issues with rants that were about the action s in the OP. However, the rants I was referring to included name calling and generalizations about a whole department and that is wanted on our Forum.

[stevie_d_64]

The reason I present these issues/incidents up for discussion is to maintain an overall awareness of what is done by certain elements, within our government, that are a little bit over the top...Whether they are true or not, factual or embelished, is up to the individual here to determine how that applies to their analysis of what is presented...

If someone in our active participant membership here were ever to experience something like this, then certainly that would/might impact many of us...

By those of us who post things like this we are not encouraging disparaging discussion about the agencies themselves, again, this is meant to let folks who may have not delved into these discussions before a chance to get an idea about how it can be, and has been in the past...

We all know that if they come knocking on your door, and they hand you a warrant...Not much you can do about it...If they do not have a warrant, then that is obvious what the solution to that predicament is...And the burn is not on you, but on them to get their act together...

In this case it appears they did some research, and went fishing...

What I do is not draw attention to my interests in anything the public can see...I don't have signs in my lawn or in the windows saying this house is protected by Smith & Wesson, there are no bumperstickers on the vehicles I drive...My public life and presentation is very subtle...

To me, that is the way to not garner additional attention...

Just my opinion...And this website, in my opinion, is the best one in years to come to learn from other peoples experiences, and apply little bits and pieces to your life that work best for you...